water pump/tensioner help, please
09-11-2008, 06:51 AM
#1
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water pump/tensioner help, please
I have a 1996 SE w/110K. I am losing a bit of water every coupla days and water pump hole appears to "seep" so I am ordering a water pump and preparing to replace. Its getting time/miles!! I tried to access stickies for the water pump replacement thread but for some reason I can't get it...: confused: Anyway, could someone please direct me to best replacement procedure thread? Also, I was reading the threads re: tensioner replacement... I don't have a rattle now, but should I go ahead and change the tensioner (and discussed gasket) to avoid a probable "noise" in the future? Do most/all (4th Gen.)VQs get this problem eventually? If so, what was the final word on part numbers (updated/replaced) needed to change tensioner (w/gasket?)? Sorry 'bout the long post but I want to avoid mile-long thread by being specific! 
Thanks y'all!! Doug
Thanks y'all!! Doug
09-11-2008, 08:17 PM
#2
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Tensioner
Changed my pump in May, 146,000 mi, had the rattle for a couple of weeks on startup, gradually it subsided. Other than the noise my tensioner was in good shape, I probably should have cleaned and degreased it first, though it wasn't that dirty.
But if a new tensioner is cheap enough, why not replace it?
But if a new tensioner is cheap enough, why not replace it?
09-12-2008, 08:51 AM
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Thank you very much for the directions to "how to" thread. VERY helpful, indeed w/ some great hints!! Was there ever a FINAL answer to timing chain tensioner (and gasket) part number to order?? I kinda got the drift that ordering (original) part(s) for a 96 had been superceded by a new replacement number that was proper to use on my 96... I really appreciate your help!!
Thank you, Doug
Thank you, Doug
09-15-2008, 08:57 AM
#8
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Thank you for the post! I called David...he said if I wanted to do the tensioner update/replacement I needed to order the 13091-31U26 kit...which will require removal of timing gear/chain cover to replace different size tensioner assy (not able to access change through access opening) and replace guide at same time. I guess I might as well prepare for additional labor while I replace water pump...car has 115K and I do plan on keeping it. I'm guessing added labor and parts are an investment rather than just replacing pump and hoping tensioner/guide doesn't cause problem before next water pump (another 115K 
). A question of "am I feeling lucky"... or just spend it now! 
Thanks!! Doug
). A question of "am I feeling lucky"... or just spend it now! Thanks!! Doug
09-15-2008, 02:50 PM
#9
Either way ... when you pull the TC tensioner, if you remove the top bolt (with the bottom bolt loose) it will alow it to slip backwards (towards the rear of the engine) and that can help a lot in getting the spring / piston pushed back and locked in place. I used a paper clip to lock the piston back when I did mine, worked just fine.
Thanks guys!
09-16-2008, 08:48 AM
#12
It's not that bad, PIA for sure, but ... you can do it. I removed my front engine mount to get more room too ... not sure you can get by without removing it or not, but it sure made a lot more room when it was out.
12-21-2008, 12:55 PM
#13
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Just want to FIRST THANK EVERYONE who posted their experiences w the gen 4 maxima water pump. I just found this site, and am going through this same BS right now.
Its funny to read bout those to broke off the the threaded M8 holes. I did too!
And about that chain that wont loosen up enough to get the pump out, what a pain in the ***.
I have gone so far as to whip out the Dremel and grind the gears off! Dont bother, it didnt work.
IM NOW GONNA REMOVE the tensioner since that I have read about others doing it. Really wanted to, but I was afraid of the chain coming too loose and off the crank, only to start it up and ruin the motor. I guess we will see!
Im taking pix of this mess for it is the most retarded thing Ive ever tackled. American and German engines are soo much easier, but then again, they dont run forever.
But anyway, thanks everyone! And I will post all those pics when Im done to help others in the future!!
Its funny to read bout those to broke off the the threaded M8 holes. I did too!
And about that chain that wont loosen up enough to get the pump out, what a pain in the ***.
I have gone so far as to whip out the Dremel and grind the gears off! Dont bother, it didnt work.
IM NOW GONNA REMOVE the tensioner since that I have read about others doing it. Really wanted to, but I was afraid of the chain coming too loose and off the crank, only to start it up and ruin the motor. I guess we will see!
Im taking pix of this mess for it is the most retarded thing Ive ever tackled. American and German engines are soo much easier, but then again, they dont run forever.
But anyway, thanks everyone! And I will post all those pics when Im done to help others in the future!!
12-21-2008, 07:41 PM
#15
12-22-2008, 07:34 AM
#16
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Join Date: Dec 2005
Posts: 23
Not likely at all. The chain is going to rest on the camshaft sprockets when the tension is removed.
Just be VERY CAREFUL about releasing the chain tension. I wasn't, and the bolt that pushes against the tensioner got away from me and fell into the innards of the chain cover. Luckily I was able to retrieve it with a magnet on a string. I didn't reinstall it though. I replaced it with a new spring/bolt assembly while I had the access cover open because the spring did seem a little weak.
Just be VERY CAREFUL about releasing the chain tension. I wasn't, and the bolt that pushes against the tensioner got away from me and fell into the innards of the chain cover. Luckily I was able to retrieve it with a magnet on a string. I didn't reinstall it though. I replaced it with a new spring/bolt assembly while I had the access cover open because the spring did seem a little weak.
12-22-2008, 07:37 AM
#17
Not likely at all. The chain is going to rest on the camshaft sprockets when the tension is removed.
Just be VERY CAREFUL about releasing the chain tension. I wasn't, and the bolt that pushes against the tensioner got away from me and fell into the innards of the chain cover. Luckily I was able to retrieve it with a magnet on a string. I didn't reinstall it though. I replaced it with a new spring/bolt assembly while I had the access cover open because the spring did seem a little weak.
Just be VERY CAREFUL about releasing the chain tension. I wasn't, and the bolt that pushes against the tensioner got away from me and fell into the innards of the chain cover. Luckily I was able to retrieve it with a magnet on a string. I didn't reinstall it though. I replaced it with a new spring/bolt assembly while I had the access cover open because the spring did seem a little weak.
12-22-2008, 10:29 PM
#18
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SUCCESS!!
Thanks so much for all the help found in this forum.
After removing the tensioner, the pump slid right out. took finesse getting the new one in but not that bad. Not gonna lie, was very worried about the chain skipping a tooth while it was loose and ruining the motor upon startup. And it IS possible. I checked the chain tension with the pump out and it was disengaged from the crank, which if it went back on the wrong tooth, I dont think the change in cam timing would benefit me.
To those who are considering the DIY....
Dont do it unless you have a larger than normal assortment of automotive tools and you have more experience than just pulleys, chips, exhaust, tune ups and oil changes. I have tons of tools and a cherry picker (to hold the motor with the mount off and lift it the few inches needed..) and without it would have sucked more.
I could easily see an inexperienced person f*cking up big time, or getting stuck wit the car in the garage and having to tow it to a shop to finish the job, which will BTW leave you without a warranty cuz you brought the car to them half taken apart.
Think about your skills and resources before attempting this.
Thanks so much for all the help found in this forum.
After removing the tensioner, the pump slid right out. took finesse getting the new one in but not that bad. Not gonna lie, was very worried about the chain skipping a tooth while it was loose and ruining the motor upon startup. And it IS possible. I checked the chain tension with the pump out and it was disengaged from the crank, which if it went back on the wrong tooth, I dont think the change in cam timing would benefit me.
To those who are considering the DIY....
Dont do it unless you have a larger than normal assortment of automotive tools and you have more experience than just pulleys, chips, exhaust, tune ups and oil changes. I have tons of tools and a cherry picker (to hold the motor with the mount off and lift it the few inches needed..) and without it would have sucked more.
I could easily see an inexperienced person f*cking up big time, or getting stuck wit the car in the garage and having to tow it to a shop to finish the job, which will BTW leave you without a warranty cuz you brought the car to them half taken apart.
Think about your skills and resources before attempting this.
12-23-2008, 06:27 AM
#20
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My fault - bolt with screws wasn't what I mean. I was thinking more like a rifle bolt - or plunger-type think that pushes against the tensioner
12-23-2009, 06:02 PM
#24
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Water Pump/Timing Chain Tensioner Shrapnel
I'm doing water pump also and lost the spring and plunger off the tensioner. Got them fished out with a magnet. Is there also a plastic guide in that assembly? Hoping to not have to take off the timing chain cover. Thanks.
12-28-2009, 11:02 AM
#25
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Not likely at all. The chain is going to rest on the camshaft sprockets when the tension is removed.
Just be VERY CAREFUL about releasing the chain tension. I wasn't, and the bolt that pushes against the tensioner got away from me and fell into the innards of the chain cover. Luckily I was able to retrieve it with a magnet on a string. I didn't reinstall it though. I replaced it with a new spring/bolt assembly while I had the access cover open because the spring did seem a little weak.
Just be VERY CAREFUL about releasing the chain tension. I wasn't, and the bolt that pushes against the tensioner got away from me and fell into the innards of the chain cover. Luckily I was able to retrieve it with a magnet on a string. I didn't reinstall it though. I replaced it with a new spring/bolt assembly while I had the access cover open because the spring did seem a little weak.
This website has been the greatest. I have a 1996 Max with 246K mileage and this is the first time it has needed the water pump. Damned inconvenient to get to...
Last edited by Beorn; 12-28-2009 at 05:46 PM.
12-28-2009, 06:04 PM
#26
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Just in case I did not make myself clear in my previous post, while working on my 96 GLE Max (replacing the water pump), the ONE THING I didn't want to do, I did. The spring-loaded piston from the timing chain tensioner flew off after removing the first bolt. It fell inside the timing chain cover.
I have used a flexible gripper, a magnet on the gripper, a magnet on a extendable rod, a magnet on a string, and even the same string/magnet with a tube delivery to get past the rocker arm of the timing chain tensioner.
Does anyone have ANY ideas? The previous posts said that they used a magnet on a string, but that isn't working for me. Am I missing something? I do NOT want to remove the entire side of the engine; not even certain I can.
Any help at all would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks again!
I have used a flexible gripper, a magnet on the gripper, a magnet on a extendable rod, a magnet on a string, and even the same string/magnet with a tube delivery to get past the rocker arm of the timing chain tensioner.
Does anyone have ANY ideas? The previous posts said that they used a magnet on a string, but that isn't working for me. Am I missing something? I do NOT want to remove the entire side of the engine; not even certain I can.
Any help at all would be greatly appreciated!
Thanks again!
02-28-2010, 08:00 PM
#27
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Posts: 2
I just replaced the water pump on my 1995 GXE about 5 days ago. I did lose the spring and plunger in the timing chain cover
. I was able to send a flexible magnet behind the timing chain guide and retrieve both of them
.if you search the timing chain cover removal threads, there are some clear pictures of where the tensioner spring and plunger are likely to fall. My car still has a rattle in the chain cover at all revs and temperatures, but runs and responds smoothly otherwise. Does anyone know what could be causing this?
. I was able to send a flexible magnet behind the timing chain guide and retrieve both of them.if you search the timing chain cover removal threads, there are some clear pictures of where the tensioner spring and plunger are likely to fall. My car still has a rattle in the chain cover at all revs and temperatures, but runs and responds smoothly otherwise. Does anyone know what could be causing this?
05-28-2010, 01:01 AM
#28
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I read somewhere else that the tensioners are different in later year 4th gens. They are supposed to be updated/improved. Anyone know if this is true? Do people still change them as preventive maintenanvce on the later year 4th gens?
05-28-2010, 06:10 AM
#29
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Location: Worcester, MA
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yes there is an improved design.
No we dont jus change them out for preventative maintenance. Timing chain not normal maintenance.
EDIT:
Use the Noobie Thread for posting questions rather than bump old threads with unrelated topics. Thats what the noobie thread is for.
Its pretty good reading too as there is a LOT of info in there.
No we dont jus change them out for preventative maintenance. Timing chain not normal maintenance.
EDIT:
Use the Noobie Thread for posting questions rather than bump old threads with unrelated topics. Thats what the noobie thread is for.
Its pretty good reading too as there is a LOT of info in there.
Last edited by cashoit; 05-28-2010 at 06:12 AM.
06-05-2010, 06:01 PM
#30
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Posts: 2
Also having problems with water pump
Maxima 99
I am attempting to replace the water pump. Upon removing the timing chain tensioner, the front part of the tension (not the spring) fell inside the timing chain cover. Any advise how to retrieve this part?
I am attempting to replace the water pump. Upon removing the timing chain tensioner, the front part of the tension (not the spring) fell inside the timing chain cover. Any advise how to retrieve this part?
06-13-2010, 05:49 AM
#31
Tensioner Help
Best thing to do is what was suggested earlier, look up threads with pics of the timing cover removed and use that as a guide to find the part. Worst case scenario you can remove the outer cover, it's a lot of work and a royal PITA, but it is possible and definately do-able. And it won't mean re doing the timing either.
I have to change mine, I just got done swapping a 3.5 in and used a tensioner with 150k miles on it. Now I have rattle and need to replace it. I'll be sure and be extra careful not to drop anything down there. I would suggest that anyone attempting to do this job in the future compress the tensioner spring and insert either a push pin or paper clip into the small hole made precisely for this purpose when r&r this part.
I have to change mine, I just got done swapping a 3.5 in and used a tensioner with 150k miles on it. Now I have rattle and need to replace it. I'll be sure and be extra careful not to drop anything down there. I would suggest that anyone attempting to do this job in the future compress the tensioner spring and insert either a push pin or paper clip into the small hole made precisely for this purpose when r&r this part.
Last edited by Remminator; 06-13-2010 at 05:52 AM.
06-16-2010, 07:12 AM
#32
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Hey guys I'm trying this on saturday and ordered the water pump and tensioner..total cost for those 2 with the O-rings was 180 from the dealership..Is this a pretty good deal? I know by calling a smaller dealership I saved 40 bucks alone...Also the guy i talked to said the oil pump was attached to one of the covers i would be removing? I saw nothing about that in the write ups i looked at so just wanted to double check that. Figured he was mistaken
06-16-2010, 07:23 AM
#33
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he mistaken.
u got FSM and haynes?
THe how to is pretty good. U may have to remove the eninge mount to get to enough clearance.
Jus remember to hold down the tensioner as u loose it so it doesnt jus fly out.
u got FSM and haynes?
THe how to is pretty good. U may have to remove the eninge mount to get to enough clearance.
Jus remember to hold down the tensioner as u loose it so it doesnt jus fly out.
06-16-2010, 08:27 AM
#35
I am about 90% finished but my chain "rattles" agianst the water pump..
I am about 95% finished my water pump change out. I have a PERPLEXING question.
In the step on the FORUM DIY whre it tells you to release the tension on the chain, I may have done something different..When I went to loosen the chain by turning the crank pulley CCW 20 degrees, I may have actually turned it 30 to 35 degrees. So I may have loosened the chain a bit too much to make the water pump come out and fit back in, but i dont think so...as it was it was a bit tough to get it back in under the chain.
Everything else went fine.
After everything was back together, I was concerned about the chain seating properly on the H2O sprocket so I turned the engine CW 6 or 7 revs in a vain effort to tighten the chain up. Wow on a V6 (vice 4) that sure takes some arm strength!
Anyway I can still hear the chain rattling, or flexing, on the water pump. It certainly does not sound taut...
Should I pull the plugs turn it over maybe 15 times more to get it right?
Is there a chance I lost timing by turning the engine CCW 30 degrees vice 20 to take the tension off the chain?
I haven't run the engine yet. I am awaiting an answer to this question before I fire it up. If worse comes to worse, I can pull the valve cover to check my timing...
Hope someone can help..
In the step on the FORUM DIY whre it tells you to release the tension on the chain, I may have done something different..When I went to loosen the chain by turning the crank pulley CCW 20 degrees, I may have actually turned it 30 to 35 degrees. So I may have loosened the chain a bit too much to make the water pump come out and fit back in, but i dont think so...as it was it was a bit tough to get it back in under the chain.
Everything else went fine.
After everything was back together, I was concerned about the chain seating properly on the H2O sprocket so I turned the engine CW 6 or 7 revs in a vain effort to tighten the chain up. Wow on a V6 (vice 4) that sure takes some arm strength!
Anyway I can still hear the chain rattling, or flexing, on the water pump. It certainly does not sound taut...
Should I pull the plugs turn it over maybe 15 times more to get it right?
Is there a chance I lost timing by turning the engine CCW 30 degrees vice 20 to take the tension off the chain?
I haven't run the engine yet. I am awaiting an answer to this question before I fire it up. If worse comes to worse, I can pull the valve cover to check my timing...
Hope someone can help..
06-18-2010, 04:07 PM
#39
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Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 31
The tensioner is the little piece they are saying either move out of the way or take out completely..As I have not done this yet it I can not completely say what it looks like but only that there are pictures of it on here and that was the only thing needed to move/replace as far as the timing chain went..Regardless I would think as long as the chain did not move any on the teeth and it's not so loose it will slip it should be fine..But I am also new to working on the max's...Don't ban me for saying this but my 4th gen f-bodys camaro/and trans am the water pump is the easiest to get to and the thermostat was dream to fix...But it doesn't get 400 miles to the tank either and it being 12 years old that's pretty darn good and deff. good enough to be my daily driver.
06-18-2010, 04:19 PM
#40
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Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 118
I am about 95% finished my water pump change out. I have a PERPLEXING question.
In the step on the FORUM DIY whre it tells you to release the tension on the chain, I may have done something different..When I went to loosen the chain by turning the crank pulley CCW 20 degrees, I may have actually turned it 30 to 35 degrees. So I may have loosened the chain a bit too much to make the water pump come out and fit back in, but i dont think so...as it was it was a bit tough to get it back in under the chain.
Everything else went fine.
After everything was back together, I was concerned about the chain seating properly on the H2O sprocket so I turned the engine CW 6 or 7 revs in a vain effort to tighten the chain up. Wow on a V6 (vice 4) that sure takes some arm strength!
Anyway I can still hear the chain rattling, or flexing, on the water pump. It certainly does not sound taut...
Should I pull the plugs turn it over maybe 15 times more to get it right?
Is there a chance I lost timing by turning the engine CCW 30 degrees vice 20 to take the tension off the chain?
I haven't run the engine yet. I am awaiting an answer to this question before I fire it up. If worse comes to worse, I can pull the valve cover to check my timing...
Hope someone can help..
In the step on the FORUM DIY whre it tells you to release the tension on the chain, I may have done something different..When I went to loosen the chain by turning the crank pulley CCW 20 degrees, I may have actually turned it 30 to 35 degrees. So I may have loosened the chain a bit too much to make the water pump come out and fit back in, but i dont think so...as it was it was a bit tough to get it back in under the chain.
Everything else went fine.
After everything was back together, I was concerned about the chain seating properly on the H2O sprocket so I turned the engine CW 6 or 7 revs in a vain effort to tighten the chain up. Wow on a V6 (vice 4) that sure takes some arm strength!
Anyway I can still hear the chain rattling, or flexing, on the water pump. It certainly does not sound taut...
Should I pull the plugs turn it over maybe 15 times more to get it right?
Is there a chance I lost timing by turning the engine CCW 30 degrees vice 20 to take the tension off the chain?
I haven't run the engine yet. I am awaiting an answer to this question before I fire it up. If worse comes to worse, I can pull the valve cover to check my timing...
Hope someone can help..
I'm going to comment on one part of your post.
If you removed the tensioner to put slack on the chain, then there's no pressure in the tensioner. If you didn't run the engine yet, then no pressure was put back into the tensioner to tighten the chain.
I'm not saying to start it though.