Built turbo VQ35 in 4th Gen
09-07-2009, 07:06 PM
#1
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Built turbo VQ35 in 4th Gen
Hey guys
I rarely come to these forums any more but I thought I would share my latest project with everyone. It has been about a year in the making but it's now close to done!
VQ35DE with blockguard
Arias 8.5:1 pistons
Eagle rods
Supertech valvetrain
Custom Intake Manifold
Custom exhaust
Precision GT40R Turbo
Bosch 900 CC injectors
ARP hardware
4" Accufab throttle body
custom AEM engine management system
Built 5 speed transmission
Quaife LSD
Custom PFI twin disk hybrid clutch
Fired her up yesterday. She's too loud right now! I need to build a full map on the AEM. Shouldn't be too bad. Look forward to dyno soon and then track!
Still working on making it look better, it looks a little rough right now ... Take a look at the pictures below for now (sorry for the cell phone pics):
Old setup (very old set up .. couldn't find a pic with the MEVI insalled):
New Setup:
Picture 1:
Picture 2:
Thanks to the guys at PFI for building this work of art!
I rarely come to these forums any more but I thought I would share my latest project with everyone. It has been about a year in the making but it's now close to done!
VQ35DE with blockguard
Arias 8.5:1 pistons
Eagle rods
Supertech valvetrain
Custom Intake Manifold
Custom exhaust
Precision GT40R Turbo
Bosch 900 CC injectors
ARP hardware
4" Accufab throttle body
custom AEM engine management system
Built 5 speed transmission
Quaife LSD
Custom PFI twin disk hybrid clutch
Fired her up yesterday. She's too loud right now! I need to build a full map on the AEM. Shouldn't be too bad. Look forward to dyno soon and then track!
Still working on making it look better, it looks a little rough right now ... Take a look at the pictures below for now (sorry for the cell phone pics):
Old setup (very old set up .. couldn't find a pic with the MEVI insalled):
New Setup:
Picture 1:
Picture 2:
Thanks to the guys at PFI for building this work of art!
Last edited by turbo97SE; 09-07-2009 at 08:32 PM.
09-07-2009, 07:37 PM
#3
Damn I got more competition, this is awesome. Maxima cummunity is coming up on serious setups. you even got the same sage mist green FTW!!.
real nice setup man, Looks like it was very well planned out. What made you go with the 8.5 compression, only thing available? I went with 8.8 because it was only available through wiseco at the moment and 9.5 was probably too high.
real nice setup man, Looks like it was very well planned out. What made you go with the 8.5 compression, only thing available? I went with 8.8 because it was only available through wiseco at the moment and 9.5 was probably too high.
09-07-2009, 08:11 PM
#6
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The intake was probably one of the biggest parts of the project. I thought it might be interesting for folks to see how it came into being:
1. Make the flange - bottom piece -before, top piece after (of course)
2. Get some shiny bends!
3. Get some D Stock
4. Put them together
5. Weld together
1. Make the flange - bottom piece -before, top piece after (of course)
2. Get some shiny bends!
3. Get some D Stock
4. Put them together
5. Weld together
09-07-2009, 08:20 PM
#8
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Turbo sits real low in the engine bay ... Turbo looks tiny between all the 4" tube 
:
Some exhaust pics - the exhaust is stainless steel down pipe and aluminum main sections with v-bands connecting them all together. All of it has been gusseted for strength:
:Some exhaust pics - the exhaust is stainless steel down pipe and aluminum main sections with v-bands connecting them all together. All of it has been gusseted for strength:
Last edited by turbo97SE; 09-07-2009 at 08:24 PM.
09-07-2009, 11:00 PM
#12
The intake is stunning. Looks like something on a dragster.
How many man hours went into building that intake?
What do you think the numbers would be when it gets on the dyno?
Subscribing ...
How many man hours went into building that intake?
What do you think the numbers would be when it gets on the dyno?
Subscribing ...
09-08-2009, 07:19 AM
#14
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Thanks for the compliements. My friends Jeff and Brent deserve the credit! Jeff spent huge amounts of time making it all perfect and super bling!
No scavenge pump required. There is enough of a drop for the oil to get back to the pan. I have run a similar set up for years without an issue.
I probably will run E85 eventually but maybe not right now. Intake manifold took hundreds of hours I imagine. Every time I would go there something was being done to it. You would not believe the amount of cutting, welding, sanding, polishing etc he did to make it. Personally, I think it was overengineered, but I am definitely not complaining on the results!
Originally, I had only planned on going only to 600 HP. This thing is now built to 700+ HP. The turbo would likely be the limiter here, then the intercooler. The longest time was getting the custom clutch done surprisingly.
For the whole setup I wanted something more streetable since I don't go to the track much. Like, I said, it is way too loud right now! I'd probably get pulled over with it idling in my driveway!
I got some wiring to clean up on the AEM and a lot of tuning to do. I'll try to post a vid some time.
No scavenge pump required. There is enough of a drop for the oil to get back to the pan. I have run a similar set up for years without an issue.
I probably will run E85 eventually but maybe not right now. Intake manifold took hundreds of hours I imagine. Every time I would go there something was being done to it. You would not believe the amount of cutting, welding, sanding, polishing etc he did to make it. Personally, I think it was overengineered, but I am definitely not complaining on the results!
Originally, I had only planned on going only to 600 HP. This thing is now built to 700+ HP. The turbo would likely be the limiter here, then the intercooler. The longest time was getting the custom clutch done surprisingly.
For the whole setup I wanted something more streetable since I don't go to the track much. Like, I said, it is way too loud right now! I'd probably get pulled over with it idling in my driveway!
I got some wiring to clean up on the AEM and a lot of tuning to do. I'll try to post a vid some time.
09-08-2009, 08:36 AM
#16
Did you keep the variable valve timing? I ask because I'm pretty sure I see VQ35 timing covers on the car 
That's a pretty nice vacuum box you have there on the firewall. Any pictures of that? Also, PLEASE remove or paint those strut bar end pieces
They're an eyesore in an otherwise BEAUTIFUL engine bay.
That's a pretty nice vacuum box you have there on the firewall. Any pictures of that? Also, PLEASE remove or paint those strut bar end pieces
They're an eyesore in an otherwise BEAUTIFUL engine bay.
Last edited by Tatanko; 09-08-2009 at 08:38 AM.
09-08-2009, 12:09 PM
#20
09-08-2009, 12:35 PM
#22
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Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: New York
Posts: 80
^yea aem makes it plug and play for VE.http://www.aempower.com/Search.aspx
Good job Nigel love the build.
Mike
Good job Nigel love the build.
Mike
09-08-2009, 08:22 PM
#24
Nice setup.
What is the purpose of the fan on the condensor?
Will this PFI twin disk clutch bolt to a 3.0 flywheel?
Im also curious to see if a stock fuel rail will supply 700 whp worth of fuel
Btw would it be too much trouble to compare a gutted ssim to your custom manifold on a dyno / track?
I ask because our setups are very similar... minus the IM/TB/IC/RAD/TURBO/EMS/ & the fact that yours is running...lol
Anyways goodluck with the build
What is the purpose of the fan on the condensor?
Will this PFI twin disk clutch bolt to a 3.0 flywheel?
Im also curious to see if a stock fuel rail will supply 700 whp worth of fuel
Btw would it be too much trouble to compare a gutted ssim to your custom manifold on a dyno / track?
I ask because our setups are very similar... minus the IM/TB/IC/RAD/TURBO/EMS/ & the fact that yours is running...lol
Anyways goodluck with the build
09-08-2009, 11:06 PM
#25
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Lot's of questions. See if I can provide soem answers:
1. Variable valve timing. Yes, I kept it. Not using it yet - you can see it is unplugged in the pics. I will use them when I get the base tune done. It's fairly straight forward to set up on the AEM.
2. AEM does a plug and play for the VE? Great! I used a honda box since it was the cheapest and I did this about 3 or 4 years ago before anything was available. I think the triggering is totally different for the VE also. I am using stock VQ35 timing gear (Cam and Crank triggers from VQ35).
3. 4" piping - interesting question. Different opinions on this one. Yes it goes from 2.5" up to 4". yes, the boost PRESSURE drops, but it is the air flow mass you are interested in. Total airflow would still be the same but there would be less restriction, less back pressure holding the turbo back so it would spool faster in theory. Lot's of people challenged them on this, but they have done this on an Eclipse before and the numbers proved out. We'll see. Also I could go to a bigger turbo if really necessary
4. Transmission - boy this was done forever ago ... It is a 5 speed. The gears have been shotpeened and I was told that that was not really necessary anyway. The real key has been in a process I was told as v-cut gears. I am not 100% sure how this works. Each gear is individually hand ground allowing engagements to be swift and more precise. Don't really understand the full mechanics behind how it works. What I was told is that the gearbox itself is already very solid and people break stuff by grabbing gears incorrectly. If the gears are not correctly engaged when you release the clutch, you shear parts off the gear and break stuff. All I know is that it works cos there was a race car that was going through transmissions every 3rd race. After getting this done he's been to 6 and not yet had a problem.
5. Fans - lots of airflow into the engine bay. It is going to get hot. Keeping underhood temps down is important especially past the boost pipe. Put two high velocity fans on for that. I'll probably do something about the hood like vented CF hood. My Maxima looks like a turd right now (on the outside)
6. Twin disk will NOT bolt to 3.0 flywheel. You may want to call PFI about a 3.0 application, they are working on one for someone else. Interesting find today was that I used a stock starter and it was always engaged on the VQ35 ring gear. Had to shim it out to allow it to disengage. VQ35 and VQ30 starter are pretty much identical as far as I can see. Number of teeth differ from 1996 onwards from 8 to 11 teeth but all interchange. Don't know if there is any difference in the windings. Didn't think to check. The car sounded horrible with that starter spinning in there. Took about 20 minutes to figure that one out .. I like easy fixes like that! Now the car can idle. The tach is way off cos I am using VQ35 timing, that's low on my priority list right now.
7. Fuel rail - It should be fine to 700HP, we'll see. If it is an issue, then I will swap it out. There are lots of rails for VQ35 available.
I am trying get this done quick since I will be leaving town for a few weeks but keep bumping into small issues.
1. Variable valve timing. Yes, I kept it. Not using it yet - you can see it is unplugged in the pics. I will use them when I get the base tune done. It's fairly straight forward to set up on the AEM.
2. AEM does a plug and play for the VE? Great! I used a honda box since it was the cheapest and I did this about 3 or 4 years ago before anything was available. I think the triggering is totally different for the VE also. I am using stock VQ35 timing gear (Cam and Crank triggers from VQ35).
3. 4" piping - interesting question. Different opinions on this one. Yes it goes from 2.5" up to 4". yes, the boost PRESSURE drops, but it is the air flow mass you are interested in. Total airflow would still be the same but there would be less restriction, less back pressure holding the turbo back so it would spool faster in theory. Lot's of people challenged them on this, but they have done this on an Eclipse before and the numbers proved out. We'll see. Also I could go to a bigger turbo if really necessary
4. Transmission - boy this was done forever ago ... It is a 5 speed. The gears have been shotpeened and I was told that that was not really necessary anyway. The real key has been in a process I was told as v-cut gears. I am not 100% sure how this works. Each gear is individually hand ground allowing engagements to be swift and more precise. Don't really understand the full mechanics behind how it works. What I was told is that the gearbox itself is already very solid and people break stuff by grabbing gears incorrectly. If the gears are not correctly engaged when you release the clutch, you shear parts off the gear and break stuff. All I know is that it works cos there was a race car that was going through transmissions every 3rd race. After getting this done he's been to 6 and not yet had a problem.
5. Fans - lots of airflow into the engine bay. It is going to get hot. Keeping underhood temps down is important especially past the boost pipe. Put two high velocity fans on for that. I'll probably do something about the hood like vented CF hood. My Maxima looks like a turd right now (on the outside)
6. Twin disk will NOT bolt to 3.0 flywheel. You may want to call PFI about a 3.0 application, they are working on one for someone else. Interesting find today was that I used a stock starter and it was always engaged on the VQ35 ring gear. Had to shim it out to allow it to disengage. VQ35 and VQ30 starter are pretty much identical as far as I can see. Number of teeth differ from 1996 onwards from 8 to 11 teeth but all interchange. Don't know if there is any difference in the windings. Didn't think to check. The car sounded horrible with that starter spinning in there. Took about 20 minutes to figure that one out .. I like easy fixes like that! Now the car can idle. The tach is way off cos I am using VQ35 timing, that's low on my priority list right now.
7. Fuel rail - It should be fine to 700HP, we'll see. If it is an issue, then I will swap it out. There are lots of rails for VQ35 available.
I am trying get this done quick since I will be leaving town for a few weeks but keep bumping into small issues.
Last edited by turbo97SE; 09-08-2009 at 11:14 PM.
09-08-2009, 11:18 PM
#26
Thats interesting with the piping. I agree the turbo will spool faster since there will be less back pressure, but the reason there will be less back pressure during spool up is becaue it takes longer for pressure to build up in such large volume. So although the turbo is going to be spooling rather quick, the engine is not going to be receiving that airflow/pressure at the same rate, once the pressure does build up in the piping, then thats when the massivie airflow kicks in. According to my research piping size like you said is avery argued topic. Only numbers determine the truth, cant wait for dyno results!
09-08-2009, 11:20 PM
#27
Lot's of questions. See if I can provide soem answers:
4. Transmission - boy this was done forever ago ... It is a 5 speed. The gears have been shotpeened and I was told that that was not really necessary anyway. The real key has been in a process I was told as v-cut gears. I am not 100% sure how this works. Each gear is individually hand ground allowing engagements to be swift and more precise. Don't really understand the full mechanics behind how it works. What I was told is that the gearbox itself is already very solid and people break stuff by grabbing gears incorrectly. If the gears are not correctly engaged when you release the clutch, you shear parts off the gear and break stuff. All I know is that it works cos there was a race car that was going through transmissions every 3rd race. After getting this done he's been to 6 and not yet had a problem.
4. Transmission - boy this was done forever ago ... It is a 5 speed. The gears have been shotpeened and I was told that that was not really necessary anyway. The real key has been in a process I was told as v-cut gears. I am not 100% sure how this works. Each gear is individually hand ground allowing engagements to be swift and more precise. Don't really understand the full mechanics behind how it works. What I was told is that the gearbox itself is already very solid and people break stuff by grabbing gears incorrectly. If the gears are not correctly engaged when you release the clutch, you shear parts off the gear and break stuff. All I know is that it works cos there was a race car that was going through transmissions every 3rd race. After getting this done he's been to 6 and not yet had a problem.
V cutting the gears is what is otherwise known as detailing/deburring. Unfortunately that theory on why people are laying over the teeth on the gears is quite a way off base but I truly hope it stays together for you for as long as possible. I'm not trying to detract from the car though so please don't take this that way, I just don't want people getting the wrong idea about what really fails in these transmissions. While too harsh of engagement can cause gears tooth failure earlier than if you had a softer clutch/softer left leg, the gear tooth profile (being just too small in both width and tooth root thickness) is the primary cause of gear failure in the RS5F50A and RS5F50V trans.
The setup is awesome nigel so please don't take my post as negative.
09-09-2009, 01:16 AM
#28
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Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 750
Turbo,
Very nice build... You should be extremely proud!!! I just wanted to share a few things with you, nothing bad just some precautionary stuff.
1st) I would seriously reconsider about waiting to find out if your fuel rail will support the power levels you are planning on generating. One lean condition is all it will take to melt even the most high dollar of parts. I'm not sure what type of fuel delivery program you are running, but you might want to do some research on BSFC (Brake Specific Fuel Consumption). There are alot of factors that come into play when you are trying to feed a beast. One of the most important is how to determine the proper diameter fuel lines, bends, pick up, etc, etc, based on the amount of fuel your pump will supply & at what pressure.
Not that this is the best example but I built a 496" Stroker with a Vortech YSI for my fathers 1969 Nova. It made 880whp on 91 octane with 28* of timing. It is a beast as is yours. To feed this monster I had to utilize a return style fuel system that incooperated a EFI style fuel pump & a special regulator that would allow me to drop the fuel pressure down enough to work with a carburator. "Yes it is a blow thru design"... Now granted I know that the displacement has alot to do with the amount of fuel being consumed, but the same general principals come into play. Basically what I am getting at it this animal uses -10AN fuel line & -12AN return back to the tank to help eliminate pressure creap at the regulator.
You need to do the math & figure out exactly what the numbers are telling you to run as far as fuel system. And then you can decide if you want to improve upon that to give yourself room to grow in the future. Nothing is worse then having something limit your potential when you could of planned ahead for this the first time around.
2nd) Since you are concerned with underhood tempatures, I thought I would tell you about a product I recently came across. There is a company called DEI that makes a "Titanium Style" header wrap. Apparently is can reduce tempatures under the hood anywhere from 70 - 90*'s. That might not be much in the turbo world, but every little bit helps.
3rd) I beleive what your trying to describe with the modifications to your transmission is called "Straight Cut" gears. This is a very typical racing modification that is done in high performance manual transmissions. A good friend of mine John Calvert "Caltracks" runs this type of transmission in all of his race cars. If you ever have the need to improve upon the transmission you already have, let me know. I can put you in touch with another friend of mind who can make a you a complete set of inconel gears. It's very pricey but you gotta pay to play right?
The best stick shift driver in the world!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
http://calvertracing.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RatIU...om=PL&index=13
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qWNIb...re=PlayList&p=
Very nice build... You should be extremely proud!!! I just wanted to share a few things with you, nothing bad just some precautionary stuff.
1st) I would seriously reconsider about waiting to find out if your fuel rail will support the power levels you are planning on generating. One lean condition is all it will take to melt even the most high dollar of parts. I'm not sure what type of fuel delivery program you are running, but you might want to do some research on BSFC (Brake Specific Fuel Consumption). There are alot of factors that come into play when you are trying to feed a beast. One of the most important is how to determine the proper diameter fuel lines, bends, pick up, etc, etc, based on the amount of fuel your pump will supply & at what pressure.
Not that this is the best example but I built a 496" Stroker with a Vortech YSI for my fathers 1969 Nova. It made 880whp on 91 octane with 28* of timing. It is a beast as is yours. To feed this monster I had to utilize a return style fuel system that incooperated a EFI style fuel pump & a special regulator that would allow me to drop the fuel pressure down enough to work with a carburator. "Yes it is a blow thru design"... Now granted I know that the displacement has alot to do with the amount of fuel being consumed, but the same general principals come into play. Basically what I am getting at it this animal uses -10AN fuel line & -12AN return back to the tank to help eliminate pressure creap at the regulator.
You need to do the math & figure out exactly what the numbers are telling you to run as far as fuel system. And then you can decide if you want to improve upon that to give yourself room to grow in the future. Nothing is worse then having something limit your potential when you could of planned ahead for this the first time around.
2nd) Since you are concerned with underhood tempatures, I thought I would tell you about a product I recently came across. There is a company called DEI that makes a "Titanium Style" header wrap. Apparently is can reduce tempatures under the hood anywhere from 70 - 90*'s. That might not be much in the turbo world, but every little bit helps.
3rd) I beleive what your trying to describe with the modifications to your transmission is called "Straight Cut" gears. This is a very typical racing modification that is done in high performance manual transmissions. A good friend of mine John Calvert "Caltracks" runs this type of transmission in all of his race cars. If you ever have the need to improve upon the transmission you already have, let me know. I can put you in touch with another friend of mind who can make a you a complete set of inconel gears. It's very pricey but you gotta pay to play right?
The best stick shift driver in the world!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
http://calvertracing.com/
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RatIU...om=PL&index=13
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qWNIb...re=PlayList&p=
Last edited by nostrixoxide; 09-09-2009 at 01:21 AM.
09-09-2009, 08:08 AM
#29
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I don't take this as negative at all! Thank you for the feedback. I admit to knowing very little about transmissions. Can you direct me to information that some one has demonstrated this? I am interested to read about it more (please don't take it as prove it to me .. I am genuinely interested). According to my friend who knows a lot more than I do about transmissions and he's built and rebuilt a ton of them, that when people grab gears, the edges of the gears chip off, it is not an instant failure. This in itself reduces the meshing surface area which makes the gear weaker. Over time, this will break. This is how it was explained to me. I have seen it work, so I will go with that for now. If it breaks, I have one spare back up that I can build with thicker (perhaps straightcut gears). Think I read somewhere that those gears are available for our transmissions. Please send info or link so I can read up more ... I like to challenge my friends to see what they say.
V cutting the gears is what is otherwise known as detailing/deburring. Unfortunately that theory on why people are laying over the teeth on the gears is quite a way off base but I truly hope it stays together for you for as long as possible. I'm not trying to detract from the car though so please don't take this that way, I just don't want people getting the wrong idea about what really fails in these transmissions. While too harsh of engagement can cause gears tooth failure earlier than if you had a softer clutch/softer left leg, the gear tooth profile (being just too small in both width and tooth root thickness) is the primary cause of gear failure in the RS5F50A and RS5F50V trans.
The setup is awesome nigel so please don't take my post as negative.
The setup is awesome nigel so please don't take my post as negative.
09-09-2009, 08:31 AM
#30
Cool build, lots of potential once it's all sorted out. Nice to see someone going with a standalone rather than the sad factory crap. I have a different standalone in mind for my build, wanted to do it last year but ran out of money.
If your tranny doesn't hold up at least there's a gear set available now for the 5-spd!
Did PFI do any actual engineering on the manifold (ie runner lengths, dia's, volume etc) or is this just based on what they've done in past?
Looking forward to seeing a dyno once it's tuned up.
If your tranny doesn't hold up at least there's a gear set available now for the 5-spd!
Did PFI do any actual engineering on the manifold (ie runner lengths, dia's, volume etc) or is this just based on what they've done in past?
Looking forward to seeing a dyno once it's tuned up.
09-09-2009, 09:20 AM
#31
Nice job on the build man. Always wanted to see something ike this in a max. I have a noobish question. When you installed the AEM did you have to wire in every single wire for the car? Just curious as to how it was done.
09-09-2009, 01:34 PM
#32
Looking good man, great build. I am in the middle of an engine build myself, and had planned to do the turbo with the build. I decided that if I want 700+ whp to go with a RWD set up; mainly because of the transmission and traction issues. I enjoy my Maxima too much to take it off of daily driver status. I am excited for you and can't wait to see some dyno numbers and track times. I am sure she hauls *****.
Zack
Zack
10-02-2009, 11:13 PM
#36
This is NICE.... congrats
That intake looks great,and im sure that will work just as great.
Shame this is not being put behind a well built auto (for 1/4 mile), i doubt the 5 speed will hold up at the track. I split a gear not shifting, in gear and that was barely 393 whp, not 700 whp.
dam this is nice, oh i said that already.
That intake looks great,and im sure that will work just as great.
Shame this is not being put behind a well built auto (for 1/4 mile), i doubt the 5 speed will hold up at the track. I split a gear not shifting, in gear and that was barely 393 whp, not 700 whp.
dam this is nice, oh i said that already.
10-05-2009, 10:06 AM
#39
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Nigel you are on it again! That 4 inch piping does work. Myself and Eric had same setups that we got from PFI. I had the 2.5 inch piping. He went with 3 inch piping intake & intercooler piping. He put down 400 hp at 9 psi. I put down 352 HP at 9.7 PSI. THe only differences was our piping and boost controllers.
That 4 inch piping does work. Myself and Eric had same setups that we got from PFI. I had the 2.5 inch piping. He went with 3 inch piping intake & intercooler piping. He put down 400 hp at 9 psi. I put down 352 HP at 9.7 PSI. THe only differences was our piping and boost controllers.
