Mike90SE

iTrader: (3)

I have finally finished getting the swap complete, but I am have a few issues. Could I have some ideas from the gurus, et.al.?

A little background:

My original car is a 90SE and the donor car is a 93SE. I swapped the wiring harness for the ECU along with the ECU for obvious reasons. I did not swap the rest of the wiring harness, as I didn't think I needed to. (am I wrong here?) I swapped radiators and cooling fans also as the donors' were in better shape.

OK, to the problems:

1) Before the swap my cooling fans operated properly. Post swap they run all the time when the ignition switch is on.

2) Oil pressure switch on the VG was on the back side of the motor next to the oil filter. Oil pressure switch on the VE is on the front side of the motor next to the oil filter. The problem here is that there is no plug that goes to motor from the car. Not a huge problem, as I could run a manual oil pressure guage.

3) I can not get the car to crank. It turns over fine. Matter of fact, it was running before I pulled it. The coils are firing, but I am not so sure I am getting gas. The reason I say this is because it turns over evenly like it isn't trying to crank but will run the battery down fairly quickly. (I have worked on cars before that were not firing and this is not what it sounds like) Also, during one of the days I was not able to work on it, the weather took a turn for the worse and blew off the tarp I had covering it and then rained on the motor. Needless to say, all the connectors that are on top of the motor got soaked to the point they had water in them. I tried to use WD40 to float the water out and then dry this out with towels. I believe I got the most out, just not sure I got all of it.



That is all I can think of right now. please, Please, PLEASE help me.


Thanks in advance!

Hectic

iTrader: (20)

I'd say you are the "guru" considering nobody (here at least) has ever done a VG/VE swap. Unfortunately, because of this, you are pretty much on your own unless you want random ideas thrown at you.

You say it is "not cranking" but talk about it turning over fine and plugs sparking.. That's kind of confusing, i'm assuming it "cranks", but won't start opposed to no "crank" at all (dead starter). Anyway, trial and error time. Unless the ECU will throw some codes at you.

Anyway man, congratulations on the swap. Hopefully you can work out the bugs and get it on the road

Hectic

iTrader: (20)

Oh yeah, lets see some pics

505max94se

iTrader: (15)

I can't wait to see what a VE looks like in a 3rd gen engine bay.

JK Hectic

internetautomar

iTrader: (30)

when you say you swapped the ECU harness did you swap the entire harness that goes to the motor and the ECU or just cut off the end and are splicing things in as you go?
as far as the fans go, check your CTS
if your oil pressure switch is not connected I believe it cuts power to the fuel pump.

nismology

iTrader: (8)

Cooling fans in high speed mode constantly with the ignition switch in the ON position (a/c on or off) is one of the symptoms of a failed ECU. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if the injectors are clogged. Depends on if the rail had fuel in it while the engine was sitting around or not.

Mack531

Yeah, splicin' wiring harnesses can cause endless problems. I had some similar questions about this swap regarding the retainer of the VE wiring harness in another thread on the site. The answer was emphatic: DON'T MIX THE WIRING HARNESSES! VG for VG; VE for VE. Trying to backtrack if this was the path you took may be more trouble than it's worth. Get a complete original VE harness and good ECU.

Mike90SE

iTrader: (3)

Hectic, that is exactly what it is doing, it "cranks" just doesn't act like it wants to fire up and run.

If you have seen a 3rd gen with a VE it looks the same as one that has been swapped in. Looks like it came from the factory.

Brian, I swapped the complete harness. I did not want to do any splicing and I succeeded in that.

I am a noob with the lingo, what is a CTS.

You may be on to something about the oil pressure switch, but in pulling the VG out one of my sons' friends helped me and unfortunately the OPS did not get disconnected from the engine and that plug broke off around the harness on the drivers side. If I had some help locating where that comes out of the VG harness I might be able to rig something up there.


I highly doubt that the ECU is bad or that the injectors are clogged as I was driving the donor car up until last week. The connectors that go to the fans are part of the harness that remains from the 90 model. I wonder if there is a difference between 90 and 93 models in the wiring department?

Again, I did swap the entire harness between the enigine and the ECU to avoid splicing. Heck, I even went as far as to swap AC compressors because the electrical connector was different between them.




Something else comes to mind.....

On the 90VG, there is one fusebox under the hood. On the 93VE there is like three under there. If I have to swap the harness to get all of the fuseboxes, that will mean the ENTIRE freaking harness for the car will have to be swapped. Someone put me out of my misery and tell me I do not need those other two fuseboxes. LOL



I know that everyone will believe I have actually made the swap with pictures, but how can I prove the car actually had a VG to start with? I do not have any pics of before the swap so......

I can take pics of all the mess out in my back yard if that will suffice. LOL





Keep them ideas coming, I am far from a guru.

ColombianMax

iTrader: (7)

Damn dude, thats a lot of work. Congrats on at least getting this far. having the OPS will not cut the fuel pump off...at least not on the VG and I know cuz mine has been disconnected for some time and its been too cold to plug it back. And its also very bad to have it unplugged

Let us know how it goes

Mike90SE

iTrader: (3)

I hope you are correct about the OPS. Also, isn't your max a 93? If so, how many fuseboxes do you have under the hood? This is the biggest difference I have seen thus far between the 90 and the 93.

I will definitely let everyone know how it progresses.

ColombianMax

iTrader: (7)

Yes I have a 93 but its a GXE which = VG. I'm got 2 relay boxed. One below battery and one on side of it by fender. My gfs 89 SE has same amount on same locations. I'm thinking its a VG/VE difference and not so much year difference.

Hectic

iTrader: (20)

I was requesting proof. A handful of newbs come here claiming they have just finished large, custom projects to earn face quickly. Not that I don't believe you or anything, but nobody has ever bothered to complete this swap, surely you have some pics to show your hard work

BenStoked

iTrader: (7)

i think pics of the mounts would be informative.
I hear this is the biggest part of a swap is the engine/tranny mounts.
if we could see pics of how people conquered this obstacle, then others may be inclined to undertake this as well.
when you get the car running, let us know what some of the things you had to do to make the swap work...

Hectic

iTrader: (20)

He swapped in a VE, not a VQ.

BenStoked

iTrader: (7)

i thought the mounts for the engine were different for the ve, my bad.
i see my illogical conclusion.(same car, der...)

I WOULD like to see some vq in 3rd mounts, tho.

ColombianMax

iTrader: (7)

They are different but they bolt on just like the VG ones would on a VG engine

Greeny

iTrader: (43)

Huh?

BenStoked

iTrader: (7)

lol
let me say it in english, since aparently only i understand my thoughts

I would like to see some pictures of a 3rd gen maxima with vq motor mounts and how/where they differ from a vg/ve(without the engine/tranny)...

Greeny

iTrader: (43)

good luck with that...

SurraTT

iTrader: (59)

not on my 92 se, i installed a auto meter oil pressure, and totally unhooked the factory sending unit and harnesss. runs fine without it, no light even comes on. which i though was kinda weird. i figured it would realize A)its unhooked or b) there is no oil pressure.

Mike90SE

iTrader: (3)

It is a VG - VE swap. No major mods in this one.....yet. LOL




Yes, I knew you had a VG. That is why I was wondering how many fuse/relay boxes you had under the hood. Looks like I got some more swapping out to do as the 90 only has two and the 93 has three. Argh!




I figured that was what you were getting at. No problem. I will take pics of the carnage out on my drive, but when I am working the last thing on my mind is to take pics as I am doing something. Now for some verbal confirmation, you can ask oldngivout. He has been on the forum for quite a while. I actually went to his house and bought the donor car. Other than that you will just have to wait.



BAWAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Greeny, I thought you might have some valuable/useful information. If we got off on the wrong foot, I did not mean to. I could really use some advice/help here. Please?



Thanks, that helps me tons....really it does. I will just go get me a manual gauge and forget trying to figure out the idiot light. That is, unless I have to swap out the other part of the wiring harness.






So....can someone tell me that has or has had a VE where the harness goes to that connects to the relay box on the PS of the engine bay? As in, where does it go to inside the car?

Greeny

iTrader: (43)

Do you have an fsm?

Mike90SE

iTrader: (3)

Why, yes....yes, I do.... don't know how to read it, but I got one. Or I am just too darn lazy.....

Greeny

iTrader: (43)

Look in the EL section

sub-sections

EL-170 through EL-181


I will be glad to take a few pics and do a little electrical routing foot work tomorrow,as long as you do your part and read the el section of the FSM..

BTW,I own both vg auto and ve5 third gens.

Greeny

iTrader: (43)

oldngivout?

He lives pretty close to me,do you live in TN.?

internetautomar

iTrader: (30)

dam that was ax-backwards of nissan. they had it to cut fuel on my 84 max.

Coolant Temperature Sensor

FWIW the CTS may be contributing to your starting issue, though it is unlikely

Mike90SE

iTrader: (3)

No, I live in Fort Payne, AL. I bought some seats from him once when his daughter wrecked her 3rd gen. Anywho, I think you actually live closer to me than you do him. LOL



My FSM is mostly pics. I think it is messed up. I do not see any documentation as far as steps to do stuff.

Hectic

iTrader: (20)

Heh, man I believe you, i'm not gonna go hunting down people making sure you did it or not. I was half joking in asking for pics. No need to post pics of the remains, mid swap pics would be nice though. Taking pics during big projects is a good thing to do IMO, it allows you to take a look back at all the hard work you put into projects after the fact.. But I agree, it can be tough to stop and take the pics while you're in the middle of a project. Smoke breaks are a good time for that though..

Mike90SE

iTrader: (3)

Thanks, all this was working before I pulled the motor. Not saying that it has not gone out since, but that would be really weird.

I am afraid I have narrowed it down to the fact that my 90 does not have the relay box on the PS of the engine bay that the 93 does. It has a relay in it for the injectors and/or coils in it. I am afraid my wiring issues are not complete.

Mike90SE

iTrader: (3)

Well, I had planned to take pics all along the project, but it has been so pharkin' COLD every time I have had the chance to work on it that all I could think of was to "git 'er done!"

Tell, you what, I will do my best at a write up once, I get it running. OK?

Greeny

iTrader: (43)

meh,139 from you/115 from him..


Heh...The fsm doesn't have swap instructions,

I was referring to all the wiring diagrams and harness routing diagrams in the mentioned sections.take a good look at EL-180/EL-181 in the fsm,just to see if you have all the plugs in the right place..i may be able to come down and give you a hand if you can't figure it out yourself.

Mike90SE

iTrader: (3)

almost a wash....


Ok, I will give it a looksee. The one good thing Nissan did that I can tell, is most all plugs are unique...as in an Id10t like me can't screw them up.

This is what I told Brian a few minutes ago. The more I think about it, the more I feel this is my problem. What I was wondering without digging through the FSM, was where the drivers side of the harness goes. As in does it go all the way to the gas tank, or just up under the dash, or is it all the rest of the wires under the dash. But.....I will see if I can make heads or tails of the schematics. LOL I am a computer geek dangit, not an electrical one. LOL

BenStoked

iTrader: (7)

one computer geek to another, its all just troubleshooting. we just gotta learn how to describe the symptoms, figure out what causes the symptoms, figure out what causes that, and fix what is nesecary! 'cause thats what us geeks do on my end.

Greeny

iTrader: (43)

Well,I'll see what i can come up with tomorrow..

just for reference,you ARE getting spark...NOT getting fuel,right?

Mike90SE

iTrader: (3)

ok i'm home from work now, the relay box on the PS side has a relay for ignition coil. The motor does not wizz over like its not getting fire, meaning it is getting fire. So it sounds like something to do with the fuel, possibly the liquid that is in the fuel injector connections causing them to short?? maybe?? i dunno??

Greeny

iTrader: (43)

So you have verified that you are definitely getting spark,or are you just guessing? same with fuel(have you verified?)


It's possible

If you have access to a leaf blower,use it to dry out the engine/connectors.

Mike90SE

iTrader: (3)

Well, I haven't grabbed a hold of one of the coils and let someone turn the motor.

I guess you can say I am guessing. I do know I am going to have to replace the the coils as 4 of the 6 are cracked. I could hear what I thought was spark arcing. I know that doesn't mean that I am actually getting spark to the plugs...but I am getting spark somewhere.




I do not have a leaf blower, but I do have plenty of the compressed air that is used to blow out computers. Will that work?








I have been looking the FSM over, and if I am correct, the DS of the harness connects right at the fuse box in the dash. So maybe this won't be as bad as I am imagining it is going to be.

Mack531

I'm just wondering here, but do the VG and VE engines require an in-the-fuel-tank electric fuel pump that is unique to the engine? Do the injectors have different pressue requirements? This is one part that probably wasn't swapped-- am I right?

Mike90SE

iTrader: (3)

Well, looking at idiotzone's website the pumps are definitely different, but what is odd is the fact that the VG pump is like $298 and the VE is $84.

And you are correct.....at this point I have not swapped it.....but I will if I have to.

God it is great having a running donor car.

Greeny

iTrader: (43)

you might have hit on something there,the vg/ve pumps are different(fuel pressure wise),but I'm not sure if it's enough to prevent the car from starting/running..