97 Standard Maxima -- Starting issues. Electrical or starter, help?
10-21-2007, 09:22 AM
#1
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97 Standard Maxima -- Starting issues. Electrical or starter, help?
11/16 - FIXED!!! After lots of testing and some blood/sweat i removed the old starter and installed a new from from Kragen ($150) and it starts like a charm.
Update: 10/26---added pictures for reference. Please see most recent post.
Situation:
Started my car yesterday, no problem. I drove around for 10 minutes running an errand than returned to my place. Tried starting my car to run another errand and it wouldn't make a noise/turnover.
Symptoms:
I turn the key to the start position with the clutch in and there is no sound from the starter. There is an electrical 'click' sound so i feel as though the circuity is good.
All ideas to help diagnose would be great. I'm confident i can pull a Little Miss Sunshine and jump start my car, but i'd like to try any tests or ideas that people have before i do that and drive to a nissan dealership.
Update: 10/26---added pictures for reference. Please see most recent post.
Situation:
Started my car yesterday, no problem. I drove around for 10 minutes running an errand than returned to my place. Tried starting my car to run another errand and it wouldn't make a noise/turnover.
Symptoms:
I turn the key to the start position with the clutch in and there is no sound from the starter. There is an electrical 'click' sound so i feel as though the circuity is good.
All ideas to help diagnose would be great. I'm confident i can pull a Little Miss Sunshine and jump start my car, but i'd like to try any tests or ideas that people have before i do that and drive to a nissan dealership.
Last edited by MaximaMan; 11-18-2007 at 03:18 PM.
10-21-2007, 11:52 AM
#3
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Posts: 39
I had the same problem and it turned out to be the starter. You should find out for yourself of course. The correct way to do it is take off the air intake and measure the voltage coming into the solenoid switch. You should get voltage. If not, then the problem is not your starter.
If you got that far, then swapping out the starter is a matter of removing 2 electrical connectors and 2 bolts.
If you got that far, then swapping out the starter is a matter of removing 2 electrical connectors and 2 bolts.
10-21-2007, 12:40 PM
#4
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Update: thanks for the feedback. I decided to get my hands dirty and went outside and started shaking the wires and what not. After doing that for a few minutes and went back and turned the key and she started right up. Turned it off again, waiting a few seconds and then started it again?
So its great that its working... not so great is that i'm sure this is not the last of my starting problems.
-Me
So its great that its working... not so great is that i'm sure this is not the last of my starting problems.
-Me
10-21-2007, 04:57 PM
#6
Some easy things to do that could solve the problem:
1. Make sure battery terminals are clean.
2. Make sure cables are nice and snug on each post of the battery.
3. Follow the negative cable from the battery to where it is grounded on the body. Make sure its TIGHT and there is no corrosion/rust, and it is a good contact with the body.
Hope it helps.
1. Make sure battery terminals are clean.
2. Make sure cables are nice and snug on each post of the battery.
3. Follow the negative cable from the battery to where it is grounded on the body. Make sure its TIGHT and there is no corrosion/rust, and it is a good contact with the body.
Hope it helps.
10-21-2007, 05:24 PM
#7
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Norman ok
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mine did the same thing, and it turned out to be the wire going from the solenoid to the starter motor, it happened to me and i messed with several different wires before messing with that one and then it started, and then atleast i knew what it was, i finally replaced the starter and fixed it, just check all your connections etc. youll find it.
10-21-2007, 10:39 PM
#8
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Update: Thanks for the afternoon feedback. I successfully drove the car (started) multiple times with no issues. I ran to safeway tonight about 10pm and of course the car decided not to start.
The battery is great. definitely not the issue. its a 10 year old car and has been in a salty winter climate for the majority of its life (except the last 3-4 years in California) and i see a decent amount of corrosion on the connectors so it looks like i need a file/sandpaper/steel wool and should start there.
Please correct me if i'm wrong or missing something but the system is not too complex.
starter is connected to a ground and a power cable that runs right up to the battery. Can anyone point me to the inflection point where the "clutch" circuit meets with the power and therefore completes the system? Are there any basic fuses i could test as another simple fix?
The battery is great. definitely not the issue. its a 10 year old car and has been in a salty winter climate for the majority of its life (except the last 3-4 years in California) and i see a decent amount of corrosion on the connectors so it looks like i need a file/sandpaper/steel wool and should start there.
Please correct me if i'm wrong or missing something but the system is not too complex.
starter is connected to a ground and a power cable that runs right up to the battery. Can anyone point me to the inflection point where the "clutch" circuit meets with the power and therefore completes the system? Are there any basic fuses i could test as another simple fix?
10-22-2007, 12:32 AM
#9
I dont think your fuses are gone, otherwise it wouldnt start at all.
Did you check the ground from the battery to the body?
If you let the car sit for like 20-30 min and it starts up like normal, then I had the exact same symptoms that you did. Making the ground cable snug fixed it.
But definitely start with cleaning the connectors.
Did you check the ground from the battery to the body?
If you let the car sit for like 20-30 min and it starts up like normal, then I had the exact same symptoms that you did. Making the ground cable snug fixed it.
But definitely start with cleaning the connectors.
10-22-2007, 05:33 AM
#10
[QUOTE=Maxima-4DSC;6019105]never go to a stealership ever !
[QUOTE]
i just use them as a tool for information - and then lie to them about intending to return with a wad of hundreds so they can get started.
[QUOTE]
i just use them as a tool for information - and then lie to them about intending to return with a wad of hundreds so they can get started.
Last edited by ROCKART; 11-05-2007 at 10:45 AM.
10-22-2007, 11:00 AM
#13
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10-22-2007, 04:00 PM
#18
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Update: Wiggled all the wires early this morning from the clutch 'switch,' the ground from the starter and other cables. Also cleaned up my battery terminals. The car has started twice... its currently parked on a hill as i have little faith on it being permanently fixed.
10-22-2007, 04:20 PM
#19
wiring for starting isnt too simple on our cars, clutch interlock, anti-theft, etc. not going to be a fuse, or like stated, just wont start at all. A relay is possible though it could be 'sticking' and sometimes not work. I'd be more likely to point at a poor connection, I'd redo/upgrade all your grounds(a good idea always and a good place to start, especially if you have corrosion starting.) I had a similar problem, turned out the solonoid for the starter was cooked, but that wasnt the main cause, it was wiring under the starter relay i believe, but same boat, not sure, i got in there and played around hunting, and its worked for months on end since....
happy hunting! lol
EDIT> problem was poor tranny ground and lack of starter ground
happy hunting! lol
EDIT> problem was poor tranny ground and lack of starter ground
Last edited by TunerMaxima3000; 11-06-2007 at 06:33 PM.
10-23-2007, 01:33 PM
#20
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Oakland, CA
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MaxMan--
That sounds like what I've been dealing with for months. When it refuses to start, do all the dash lights light up but nothing else happens? What happens if you keep trying to start it? I've been able to get it to start every time, but sometimes it takes 10-15 tries. It's completely random when it happens, although it went away for a couple of weeks after I replaced the battery.
I think there's probably just enough of a voltage drop somewhere in the system to the point that it sometimes can't even crank the starter. But I would have thought it would at least spin it a little, so maybe it's just a bad contact somewhere. I've replaced the battery, starter, and ignition switch, shot contact cleaner on the starter relay and inhibitor relay (I think that was the other one), and added a ground wire from the starter to the battery. My next step will be full re-grounding, I think. Fortunately this is just an annoyance, but one of these times I'm afraid it won't start at all...
That sounds like what I've been dealing with for months. When it refuses to start, do all the dash lights light up but nothing else happens? What happens if you keep trying to start it? I've been able to get it to start every time, but sometimes it takes 10-15 tries. It's completely random when it happens, although it went away for a couple of weeks after I replaced the battery.
I think there's probably just enough of a voltage drop somewhere in the system to the point that it sometimes can't even crank the starter. But I would have thought it would at least spin it a little, so maybe it's just a bad contact somewhere. I've replaced the battery, starter, and ignition switch, shot contact cleaner on the starter relay and inhibitor relay (I think that was the other one), and added a ground wire from the starter to the battery. My next step will be full re-grounding, I think. Fortunately this is just an annoyance, but one of these times I'm afraid it won't start at all...
10-23-2007, 02:51 PM
#21
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I've pointed out what i believe to be the faulty wire on my car. I haven't removed my intake so i can't get a good luck at it, but when i felt around it seems to be corroded "open" so i could actually feel the bare wires. My car has started 4/4 since messing around with that wire and the ground...
10-23-2007, 02:53 PM
#22
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ps. that picture is from another guy who fixed his start after 5 years of hearing that stupid howl.... if it was a bit more inspirational i would fix mine too. (only 3 years)
going outside to check if i actually pointed out the right wire... update in 15
going outside to check if i actually pointed out the right wire... update in 15
10-24-2007, 08:24 AM
#23
I've pointed out what i believe to be the faulty wire on my car. I haven't removed my intake so i can't get a good luck at it, but when i felt around it seems to be corroded "open" so i could actually feel the bare wires. My car has started 4/4 since messing around with that wire and the ground...
10-24-2007, 08:33 AM
#24
I think it is corrosion on your battery terminals. The reason I say this is because its happened to me before you turn the key over and just get one "click" and the car does not turn over. When I have had a bad starter it will either not turn over at all or it will screach when it is turned over. When the battery is taking a dump it will make a rapid clicking noise when you try to start it. Good luck with the problem.
10-24-2007, 08:45 AM
#25
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When i say i hear the click i'm not talking about the click from the starter trying to turn over, but its the click from the electrical system. Anyone who has a 5spd, can turn the key with their foot off the clutch and hear the electrical click... not a dead battery (like when I leave my headlights on for 5 hours)
***I've noticed a key pattern.*** If i turn the key with my foot not fully on the pedal *almost to the floor but not quite*, and try to start the car,it won't...obviously, but this must trigger something. Its from this point on that my car won't start (with the pedal to the floor). Perhaps i'm tripping some 'saftey?' switch and it does reset unless i go and jiggle the wires?
***I've noticed a key pattern.*** If i turn the key with my foot not fully on the pedal *almost to the floor but not quite*, and try to start the car,it won't...obviously, but this must trigger something. Its from this point on that my car won't start (with the pedal to the floor). Perhaps i'm tripping some 'saftey?' switch and it does reset unless i go and jiggle the wires?
I think it is corrosion on your battery terminals. The reason I say this is because its happened to me before you turn the key over and just get one "click" and the car does not turn over. When I have had a bad starter it will either not turn over at all or it will screach when it is turned over. When the battery is taking a dump it will make a rapid clicking noise when you try to start it. Good luck with the problem.
10-24-2007, 09:06 AM
#26
[QUOTE=MaximaMan;6025494]When i say i hear the click i'm not talking about the click from the starter trying to turn over, but its the click from the electrical system. /QUOTE]
that's the same thing I am saying. When I have had corroded or loose battery terminals this is what happens.
that's the same thing I am saying. When I have had corroded or loose battery terminals this is what happens.
10-24-2007, 01:19 PM
#27
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Don't tap too loud!
Don't be a tappin' your foot too hard on that starter or the Senator from Idaho just may show up in your driveway! 
Anyway, for my two cents,
Check to see that it is getting voltage to the starter with meter, if its not then, it may be your ignition switch on the dash as I had happen. First I could futz with the key and "push" the key a little further into the start position(don't break the key!) and it would make contact. Each time a it got a little worse. Easy install, disconnect battery though. www.coustesynissan.com for diagram explode and for part identification #'s
For my 97 SE it was Part#
http://www.courtesyparts.com/betasit...-p-132324.html
Anyway, for my two cents, Check to see that it is getting voltage to the starter with meter, if its not then, it may be your ignition switch on the dash as I had happen. First I could futz with the key and "push" the key a little further into the start position(don't break the key!) and it would make contact. Each time a it got a little worse. Easy install, disconnect battery though. www.coustesynissan.com for diagram explode and for part identification #'s
For my 97 SE it was Part#
http://www.courtesyparts.com/betasit...-p-132324.html
Last edited by scooby68; 10-27-2007 at 10:08 PM.
10-26-2007, 12:37 PM
#30
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First off, sorry for the ****ty picture phone pics. I'll try and get better ones but i don't think its material to figuring out my problem.
Starting update: the car has started fine the last 7/7 times until last night. We came out from the movie theater and the car turned over but then did a chug chuug chuuug chuuuug and then went dead... almost like the battery was dead or low. The headlights were at full brightness and my battery is less than 24 months old so i don't think that's the issue.
The pictures above show the starter components. Please note i've labeled the wires A, B, C. I believe A to be the problem as the wire is open to the elements (last picture) but i really don't understand why that would cause my engine to start some of the time and not all the time.
Additionally. I'm looking for anyone who has a socket set of tools and would like to lend a hand in helping me replace the start (even though i don't think that's the problem). I need a socket set, a breaker bar, and I'll bring beer or choice of drink as payment.
Starting update: the car has started fine the last 7/7 times until last night. We came out from the movie theater and the car turned over but then did a chug chuug chuuug chuuuug and then went dead... almost like the battery was dead or low. The headlights were at full brightness and my battery is less than 24 months old so i don't think that's the issue.
The pictures above show the starter components. Please note i've labeled the wires A, B, C. I believe A to be the problem as the wire is open to the elements (last picture) but i really don't understand why that would cause my engine to start some of the time and not all the time.
Additionally. I'm looking for anyone who has a socket set of tools and would like to lend a hand in helping me replace the start (even though i don't think that's the problem). I need a socket set, a breaker bar, and I'll bring beer or choice of drink as payment.
10-26-2007, 12:43 PM
#32
go to advanced auto. They will check your electrical system for free. You could have a diode gone bad in your alt. which will give you similar symptoms as a bad battery. Basically when I diode fails it allows power to flow both ways, into and alos out of the battery (and will drain your brand new battery...this happend to me too). Maybe for no cost to you they can shead some light on the situation.
10-27-2007, 03:26 PM
#34
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Sure sounds like a selenoid issue, or maybe the safety switch. Keep us posted!
Mine did something similar twice over the last few months. Turned the key off, then back on and it started up. Cleaned my battery terminals today as a pre-caution. Already replaced the starter once...
Mine did something similar twice over the last few months. Turned the key off, then back on and it started up. Cleaned my battery terminals today as a pre-caution. Already replaced the starter once...
10-27-2007, 03:37 PM
#35
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Location: Los Angeles, california
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i have the exact same problem, my car has been towed to my house TWICE! i took the starter out and had it checked, it was working fine... my battery is brand new, my starter is also new.. i have no idea, i noticed that when i put the starter back in it started right away... the other night it wouldnt start at all then in the morning it started up, i didnt even tamper with the car... im kinda car illiterate so i dont know much about what to look for... if anyone can post picks kinda telling me where to look and what to look for i would realy appreciate it... this is a really annoying problem... my car is so unrealiable right now... help!
10-28-2007, 05:35 PM
#37
Hi.
I have a 96 infiniti i30 which is 129k on it with exactly the same problem.
The car has a hard starting problem especaily after drive 5~10 min.
I spent more than $1k to get rid of the problem for 3 months.
It still pain to me.
The list of parts which were replaced.
1. an alternator
2. a starter
3. spark plugs
4. a PCV valve
5. a coolant temperature sensor
6. an ignition switch
7. a fuel pump relay
8. a knock sensor
9. a fuel filter
10. a valve cover gasket
11. spark plug tube seals
12. a battery
13. an air filter
14. oxygen sensors
15. five ignition coils (one is left)
16. cleaned IAV valve and throttle body
17. cleaned the engine grounds
18. put the fuel system cleaner
Those are repleced by myself for 3 months
I have a 96 infiniti i30 which is 129k on it with exactly the same problem.
The car has a hard starting problem especaily after drive 5~10 min.
I spent more than $1k to get rid of the problem for 3 months.
It still pain to me.
The list of parts which were replaced.
1. an alternator
2. a starter
3. spark plugs
4. a PCV valve
5. a coolant temperature sensor
6. an ignition switch
7. a fuel pump relay
8. a knock sensor
9. a fuel filter
10. a valve cover gasket
11. spark plug tube seals
12. a battery
13. an air filter
14. oxygen sensors
15. five ignition coils (one is left)
16. cleaned IAV valve and throttle body
17. cleaned the engine grounds
18. put the fuel system cleaner
Those are repleced by myself for 3 months
10-29-2007, 07:17 AM
#39
I don't know if there is a write up on how to do it, but if you take off the clam shell off of your steering collum then you can see it. It's held in by 2 little screws.
10-29-2007, 04:40 PM
#40
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Buy a Haynes manual if you don't already have one, remember to disconnect the battery there is always a live lead to this switch. Like the other guy said remove the clam shell be careful to put everything back in same order, be sure ignition switch in same position of rotation and don't move the key once you get it coordinated, not hard to do. but the clam was a pita to get aligned on reinstall. GL