Frank Fontaine

I kind of think so, as you know I do not like the idea of a car being built in MS instead of Japan, if it costs a lot. Examples are the 6th gen or Armada. What do you think would happen, if anything, if the G35 or 350Z were made in MS?

Food for thought--take a Boxster, most of them are made in Uusikaupunki. There is no way to force yours to be built in Stuttgart. You'd think that a person who has more than 50 g's to spend could specify, but no. Boxster happens to be the low-end car for Porsche. I think that making Carerras in Uusikaupunki would ruin the value of it.

imho Nissan can get away with the MS build because not very many Nissan drivers are critical or enthusiasts of autos, and many are leased anyway. It wouldn't surprise me if they are weighing the savings vs. consumer response of a G35/350Z MS build.

99Maxima5sp

No, i think thats something from the past. I dont believe the place has anything to do with build quality anymore.


My .02

Eric

Shingles

I don't think it matter where it's build, more who builds it.
When i say who I mean the company. Quality Control can be done in any country.

Dave B

Build quality has nothing to do with who is assembling the car, it has to do with who is designing the car. Components don't fit well or are of poor quality has everything to do with the engineering department. Toyota and Honda have been turning out very high quality cars that are built in the US (nearly one of their cars are built here). Remember that the plants here in the US are just assembly plants, they don't make the parts nor do they assemble the motors and trannies. Most of that is still done manufacturing plants in Japan and such.


Dave

Frank Fontaine

I like all the comments so far. I am serious though, it DOES matter to me where it's built. True, high quality can be achieved anywhere. But from my understanding, the UAW has been shut-out of all of the lower-cost plants except for Mercedes Benz in AL. That means significantly lower operating costs for the mfg., which, by the way, is not passed on to the consumer. Look at the prices of the Armada and 6th gen.

The other issue is the intangible--the German-made Boxster is more desirable by the Boxster lovers than the Finnish one. No way to get a German-made one even if you are custom-ordering it new (color, leather to sample, etc.). There are those who said a liquid-cooled Porsche is not a real Porsche. Now they are saying a Porsche mfg. outside of Germany is not a real Porsche. How about a commemorative Buck knife made in China, is that a real Buck knife? The buyer really decides the answer!

Zero Deuce SE

It really does not matter to me where the vehicle is built. As long as the quality is equal to a Japanese assembled Nissan, a TN built Nissan is fine with me. My 95 KingCab was built in TN and has great fit, finish and reliability. As I understand it, the American plants are under Japanese supervision and follow the same standards as the Japaneses plants in their homeland.

MaximamixaM

I like the US and would prefer to keep the country strong by buying cars and labor from the US. I'm guessing that pride in the Job and attention to detail is more important in Japan. Look at all the wiring, paint, etc. in a car. It needs careful assembly. I'm sad that the Maxima is made in USA now, because the point of an import car should be for a choice of assembly. So, I can see that keeping jobs in the US is good for America, but for such an expensive vehicle-I want to know it is built the best it can be built, to last a long time. That being said, Honda has had good success with made in America Accords for a long time. And Consumer Reports had two early nineties Camrys, and the made in Japan had more assembly errors. So overall, I guess made in the USA is a good thing, if the quality stays high.

Frank Fontaine

Even if the rules are different, ie the UAW workers are shut-out? So, in Mississippi it's ok to build vehicles at cheap labor rates, and charge over 35 grand for it?

I understand, Democrats are hard to find these days. Everyone that works for me flys the big elephant. Little do they know that GW B is not looking out for them, they don't make enough. GW wants to eliminate overtime wages. None of the folks that work for me are hourly, they're all exempt. But they don't get it.

irish44j

iTrader: (38)

Unions - hmmph! I have 2 college degrees and have a national-security job (keeping all your a.s.s.es safe), and I make less $$ than a UAW car-assembly dude in his 2nd year with a high school degree- and I don't get overtime either, I work until the work is done.

Just wait until McDonald's is unionized, then you'll be paying $6 for a Big Mac so they can pay $20/hour to the guy making the fries....

So cry me a river about UAW assembly vs. non-union plants. Non-union workers I would think wouldl work harder since they do not have the same job security as a union person does and need to impress the bosses.

I used to work in landscaping in college and saw how hard the non-union (legal) Mexicans worked...they worked their butts off and really knew what they were doing.

Unionization is good to a degree as it protects the blue-collar worker from getting shafted. But at the same time, it's workforce blackmail to the business owner...where do you draw the balance?

I am not bashing unions in general, just saying that it's silly to say union labor makes better product than non-union. ......

but back on-subject....

As to your Boxster - having worked with Finnish engineers (not misspelled, I mean engineers from Finland) on several projects and seen many Finnish military products (i.e. weapons and elex) - I would take something built in Finland anytime over something built in Germany.

Look at the VW Jetta - built in Germany, and my wife's Jetta was in the shop every month!

Doesnt' matter where it's built in my book -

on a last political note, though - keep thinking John Kerry is looking out for the working man - Kerry has far more $$$$ than GWBush ever willl have - Kerry and his wife are worth over half a BILLION $$! So he's not looking to hook YOU up, he likes the rich even more than George Dubya does....and he has a gay haircut.

Ant96GLE

iTrader: (4)

I totally agree with Dave B on this one. Its the engineering and quality control that play the part not where its made.

When you think about it, most of the people buying Porsches are enthusiasts. They have that kind of money to spend on a 2 seat roadster, even if it is their cheapest one. In reality its not going to be a daily driven car, more of a weekend thing. So the person buying it is going to be more concerned hes getting a "real" German car. Its about the customer and how much of an enthusiast he really is. He or she is going to have that on their mind and want what their getting for that nameplate. On the other hand I dont know if there would be much of a difference in a German vs Finnish made Porsche, I'm not familiar with them.

When you think about a 350 being made here in the US, I dont think it would really matter much at all in quality. Beetles are being made south of the border, Mustangs up north.

It depends on the car and kind of car. A weekend car like the Porsche is going to be under alot more scrutiny than a 350 which is a little more livable with on a daily basis.

Frank Fontaine

I can give you an example supporting what you say--What's the finest kitchen stuff you can get for your home? Many will agree it's all made by Viking. Your talking $1600 for a range hood (blows outside obviously), $4000 for a gas range, $250 for a skillet (7-ply 18/10 stainless--don't ask for 7-ply at the overpriced Williams-sonoma they'll recommend a less costly to mfg. one that you can buy at the mall). Where's the co. based--you guessed it, Mississippi! On the 7-ply stainless, it's actually designed in MS but made in Belgium.

I guess it comes down to preference. To me, Leica must be made in Germany. Sony should be made in Japan, as well as Nikon. Tools, made in USA. Stanley has a Taiwan-made knock off of the Snap-On ratchet, but even though they look alike, they are not designed and crafted alike. These days, the words "made in Japan" are getting more and more scarce. But ultimately it's the buyer's money, so he can spend it in whatever way he sees fit.

Zero Deuce SE

Yes, they were replaced by "made in China/Taiwan."

G20Flyer

Not to be off topic, but I just wanna give an example:

I would say with unions, it would depend on what your profession is and the people in the union. For me, my union ALPA (Airline Pilots Association) is important. Why? Becuase as a pilot I have a four year degree. Not only that, I have spent over $50,000 and time getting trained on top of my 4 year degree. I make $18,000 a year to fly people around in a jet at an airline. I am only allowed to fly 75 hours per month and get paid by the hour. As a professional, I do NOT get paid for time before and after my flight (well a tiny perdiem which is nothing like $1.24/hr). If it wasnt for my union, we probably would be having longer duty hours and less pay...for what I would like to believe now that we are the lowest professional paid job with the most responsibility for human life.

Anyways on that note...I believe it depends on how the company is doing that year and what their cost cuts are for the vehicle in the manufacturing process. Take the BMW 330 and a X3. Both high end models with some options will be just about exactly the same price ~$42,000. The 330 actually even might be a tiny bit more. How can a larger vehicle with more raw material and a brand new design cost less than the 330? Simple. One, it is made from cheaper stock. You can tell when you get in it that the dash and other material is not up to the same quality of the sedan. 2nd, it is made at a new location that none of the other BMW's are made. Contracting is becoming the waveeee of the future boys and girls...sooner or later the whole world is going to be contracted out to one another till it comes around in a big circle.

Each car is pretty much made the same. However, I would say that quality assurance plays a roll. I believe that the guy who works quality on a thursday evening will not have the same standards as the guy who works on friday morning...you may get lucky, you may not. Remember that they're all humans and just like you and I...we have crappy days and good days.

Zero Deuce SE

Do you have a 2nd job? $18k per year is peanuts for a pilot.

G20Flyer

Well...i mean im sitting reserve first officer...so yeah its starting salary. Most regional guys average around 30's. You really cant work another job unless they are REALLY understanding...reason being by the time ur done with ur flight...packup and whatnot get home...change...goto another job its a few hours. Hopefully after a year i'll move up...

Ant96GLE

iTrader: (4)

Your right, although honestly I have no idea about the kitchen stuff but the tool stuff I do know about, but to me it depends on the buyer and how picky he or she is on it. In reality business will always be business and profit will always rule, make it as cheap as possible and sell it as high a price as you can.

To me I personally, its design quality and the manufacturing process. The reason Japanese cars are now being mass produced here is to avoid paying for shipment and tariffs.

What I would look into if you really want to research on the subject is the robots and machines making these "Japanese" Nissans here in the states. Are those machines made here or made in Japan and shipped here? They do the bulk of the work, not the Americans on the assembly line. If the car is engineered over in Japan I would hope the robots would be too to meet the strict quality standards.

96sleeper

iTrader: (4)

I think it is funny how people hold the Japanese in high regard when it comes to the automotive industry. I am an engineer for a Japanese tier 1 automotive supplier in the United States. We make antivibration products and engine mounts for Nissan, Honda, Toyota, Ford, Subaru, and many others. The Japanese are not any better at it than anyone else. It is the quality control system that the Japanese use that makes it good, not better parts or workers. Like Dave b said, it doesn't matter where the parts are made. I have worked very closely with many Japanese people in the plant, and they are no smarter, or better at their jobs than I am. It is just the systematic way of doing things through Kaizen, Poke-Yoke, and other quality control methods.

Phatmax98

iTrader: (2)

If you're sure about this, then why do the New chevy's, ford's and dodge's still suck? I mean honestly..how many imports does everyone see broke down on the road...there are not that many..but you see american built cars broke down all the time...but it also deals with how well you maintain your vehicle...this is just my opinion