Cheap rod bolt alternative
03-25-2008, 08:58 AM
#1
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (29)
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Middleboro/Carver, Ma
Posts: 4,572
Cheap rod bolt alternative
From left to right: Standard VQ35DE, ARP, Rev-Up model
I can already see this starting a huge argument, so let me just state FTR..........
I am NOT saying that Rev-up rod bolts are = to ARP, in fact I'm not even coming close to saying that.
I am merely posting side-by-side comparison pics since I had the opportunity to do so, allthough I will say this: With the rev-ups increased rev-limit, and the fact that these bolts are only $30 vs $180, this might be a cheaper alternative for those that want to rev out to 7200 safely.
Last edited by KRRZ350; 03-25-2008 at 09:00 AM.
03-25-2008, 10:26 AM
#2
Pics don't really tell us anything about tensile strength or hardness, but thanks? 
And since the standard bolts are good to 7100 RPM, would it really be worthwhile to go through the trouble for a 100 RPM improvement?
And since the standard bolts are good to 7100 RPM, would it really be worthwhile to go through the trouble for a 100 RPM improvement?
03-25-2008, 10:44 AM
#3
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (29)
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Middleboro/Carver, Ma
Posts: 4,572
Very good point, but if the stock bolts are good for 500+ over stock limit, don't you think the rev-ups are good much past their stock limiter as well? I merely said 7200 to hold myself of any liability.
03-25-2008, 10:51 AM
#4
the standard bolt are good past 7100, to where, we cant tell unless we know the inside workings from nissan themselves.
but yeah the stats on the nissan bolts would be important to know, even though one would have to make an educated guess that the hardware would be an improvement over the ones used before. or at least as good. but unless you are building a motor on the cheap there would be no need to swap them out.
but nice job either way, its good for people to see a difference and make their own choice.
but yeah the stats on the nissan bolts would be important to know, even though one would have to make an educated guess that the hardware would be an improvement over the ones used before. or at least as good. but unless you are building a motor on the cheap there would be no need to swap them out.
but nice job either way, its good for people to see a difference and make their own choice.
03-25-2008, 11:36 AM
#5
The safe limit is 7100 according to independent testing by Technosquare. They ran a non-revup VQ35 continuously at 7200 RPM and had rod bolt failure after 15 minutes. This does not mimic real-world conditions, but 7200 is too close to the operational limit IMO. So I would settle for a 7100 RPM rev-cut if I had stock rod bolts.
03-25-2008, 11:41 AM
#7
It's not safe to assume that both RB's are good for the same number of revs past their respective stock redlines. Revups might only be good for 200-300 RPM over stock. The stresses the rod bolts see go up exponentially as revs rise.
Last edited by nismology; 03-25-2008 at 11:46 AM.
03-25-2008, 09:45 PM
#8
03-26-2008, 07:59 AM
#11
Cool
The Non Hr arp's are 28ftlbs loosen/tighten 3x.
I would use the Rev-ups/Hr's based on the pics/rev limit's & torque specs.
Although there is no substantial proof the Hr's are stronger, they are much cheaper than Arp's
The only sensible reason's for nissan to have change the rod bolts through the the years is: 1.Cost effect 2.Strength (durability) .....
The Non Hr arp's are 28ftlbs loosen/tighten 3x.
I would use the Rev-ups/Hr's based on the pics/rev limit's & torque specs.
Although there is no substantial proof the Hr's are stronger, they are much cheaper than Arp's
The only sensible reason's for nissan to have change the rod bolts through the the years is: 1.Cost effect 2.Strength (durability) .....
03-26-2008, 08:22 AM
#12
Cool
The Non Hr arp's are 28ftlbs loosen/tighten 3x.
I would use the Rev-ups/Hr's based on the pics/rev limit's & torque specs.
Although there is no substantial proof the Hr's are stronger, they are much cheaper than Arp's
The only sensible reason's for nissan to have change the rod bolts through the the years is: 1.Cost effect 2.Strength (durability) .....
The Non Hr arp's are 28ftlbs loosen/tighten 3x.
I would use the Rev-ups/Hr's based on the pics/rev limit's & torque specs.
Although there is no substantial proof the Hr's are stronger, they are much cheaper than Arp's
The only sensible reason's for nissan to have change the rod bolts through the the years is: 1.Cost effect 2.Strength (durability) .....
03-26-2008, 09:51 AM
#13
The safe limit is 7100 according to independent testing by Technosquare. They ran a non-revup VQ35 continuously at 7200 RPM and had rod bolt failure after 15 minutes. This does not mimic real-world conditions, but 7200 is too close to the operational limit IMO. So I would settle for a 7100 RPM rev-cut if I had stock rod bolts.
the only reason i say that is because I have been able to see things while at school and here at work that shows that failures can happen and it isnt normally rpm dependant. I have seen two similar motors and one died at a lower rpm while the other was reved a bit higher.
also the stress that is felt by the rod bolts or any part for a long duration is great for endurance testing if you are building a race car such as a nascar which will see 9000 rpm for some 500 miles, but you wouldnt need parts as durable for a street car that will hit 9000 rpm for maybe a sec if that at all. if maybe possible to have it last you many times longer due to the brief strain and elongation that the parts will suffer at the rpm for such a short time.
i cant speak for all bolts that are in the engine they tested but bolts in general will go through many cycles and if its kept within its limits it will have no problem doing that extension and compression cycle all day long. but the constant cycles put on the motor by technosquare just showed how long the bolts will stand up the the heat generated by its cycleing(sp) and not so much the rpm limit of them.
to do that you would have to find out how much strain is placed on a rod bolt/rpm and then figure out if that is to close to its limits and go from there.
thats my .02 and i am not knocking technosquare since i am always happy to see people doing testing on parts, just every test not done to rule out other factors should be used with a * attached to it.
03-26-2008, 09:55 AM
#14
I, for one, am not willing to use my motor as a guinea pig. So ARP 5/16" (or HR's if they're compatible) will be happily splish-splashing around in the finest of Amsoil lubricants.
Nicely put. 
03-26-2008, 08:33 PM
#18
Tried looking around for one today, but apparently we haven't built any HR's yet.
03-26-2008, 10:34 PM
#19
I am actually going to get the ARP brand still for my build, its really not that much of a big deal if you have a second engine that you are building, its pretty easy if its anything like the other engines I have done (obviously the engine is out of the car)
So is the limit for the ARPs 7200 rpms if I've read correctly? I was really hoping for 7500
So is the limit for the ARPs 7200 rpms if I've read correctly? I was really hoping for 7500
03-27-2008, 04:01 AM
#21
You read incorrectly. ARP rod bolts are good for 8000+ RPM. The conservative 7200 RPM figure was in reference to the Revup rod bolts. In any case, VQ30's have a stronger stud/nut setup as opposed to bolts in VQ35's. For reference, DandyMax was running the OEM stud/nut in his engine. No issues there.
03-27-2008, 06:01 AM
#22
03-27-2008, 06:37 AM
#24
where are you! 
03-31-2008, 06:17 AM
#25
11-18-2008, 09:32 AM
#29
I ended up ordering brand new DEK rod & rod bolts/nuts from Dave B. I was about to order custom rod but I was literally flooded with e-mail saying to not spend that much money on rod unless I want a 500HP + engine, I was strongly suggest to stick with brand new dek rod & bolts saying they are good enough for 400HP + at the wheel, wich honestly is good enough for my build.
AA
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
My Coffee
New Member Introductions
15
06-06-2017 02:01 PM
CAN-Toronto FS: Basement cleaning
knight_yyz
5th Generation Classifieds (2000-2003)
12
11-01-2015 01:34 PM
RealityCheck
4th Generation Maxima (1995-1999)
7
10-02-2015 06:34 PM