light flywheel ?????
07-11-2006, 12:52 PM
#1
light flywheel ?????
dont worry im not a 
so im not going to ask stupid crap.
I drive a 98 SE 5spd and my current setup is a mevi, PR style intake. budget y-pipe and flow master exhaust. im in the process of doing MAJOR repairs on my ride. but i need input from the light flywheel drivers.
do you have any pros and cons of going this route?
how long have you had it?
were you stock flywheel before?
also does anyone know the weight of a 5th gen oem flywheel (is it lighter or heavier) and would it bolt up to a 4th gen tranny.
the reason for all of the queries is since its time to replace im not gonna go oem on a lot of things. im doing it the way i should have in the first place since i DO plan on keeping her in the family for many years to come. i want be sure im making a sound investment. any help is greatly appreciated.
thanks-
navfe
so im not going to ask stupid crap.I drive a 98 SE 5spd and my current setup is a mevi, PR style intake. budget y-pipe and flow master exhaust. im in the process of doing MAJOR repairs on my ride. but i need input from the light flywheel drivers.
do you have any pros and cons of going this route?
how long have you had it?
were you stock flywheel before?
also does anyone know the weight of a 5th gen oem flywheel (is it lighter or heavier) and would it bolt up to a 4th gen tranny.
the reason for all of the queries is since its time to replace im not gonna go oem on a lot of things. im doing it the way i should have in the first place since i DO plan on keeping her in the family for many years to come. i want be sure im making a sound investment. any help is greatly appreciated.
thanks-
navfe
07-11-2006, 01:29 PM
#2
I"ve had toasted my stock 4th gen flywheel. Then got on a stillen flywheel. It's not so bad, and had no issues till I installed jwt cams. I really dont' think it's the cams power that killed the flywheel, but that stillen flywheel snapped in 2 pieces. I later found out that the mechanics torqued it down too hard, so it snapped. Anyways, now I'm running the Fidanza's, no problems so far. I took the cams off for a bigger project.
07-11-2006, 02:14 PM
#3
Supporting Maxima.org Member
iTrader: (54)
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Northern Jersey
Posts: 10,166
I like the Fidanza cause its not TOO TOO light. Its still driveable and doesnt effect driveablity. I also like the Fidanza cause its totally rebuildable. The friction disk comes off and can be replaced for $90 if you ever replace your clutch. Its a good thing to think about.
-matt
-matt
07-11-2006, 07:06 PM
#5
I drive my car 100 miles roundtrip a day with the fidenza lightweight flywheel and also a lightweight aluminum pressure plate from SPEC.... no driveability issues here.
I've had it for about 20,000 miles so far. It is significantly lighter than the OEM components (fidenza 11 lbs, SPEC pp 10 lbs). Lighter drivetrain = engine works less hard
I've had it for about 20,000 miles so far. It is significantly lighter than the OEM components (fidenza 11 lbs, SPEC pp 10 lbs). Lighter drivetrain = engine works less hard
07-11-2006, 09:45 PM
#7
Originally Posted by matty
I like the Fidanza cause its not TOO TOO light. Its still driveable and doesnt effect driveablity. I also like the Fidanza cause its totally rebuildable. The friction disk comes off and can be replaced for $90 if you ever replace your clutch. Its a good thing to think about.
-matt
-matt
07-11-2006, 09:54 PM
#8
Supporting Maxima.org Member
iTrader: (54)
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Northern Jersey
Posts: 10,166
Originally Posted by Blackwind
did you have it before the boost? if so did you spin 1st gear at all?
07-12-2006, 08:11 AM
#10
I have a 95, and Spec doesn't sell their flywheels to 95's in general, so I won't know about Spec flywheels simply because I've never owned one.
But...I'll also add this info on here, this should also be in the stickies about the general flywheel specs: I own both Stillen and Fidanza Flywheels, and by comparison, this is what I've found:
Flywheel cost:
(Both Stillen and Fidanza flywheels have the replaceable friction Ring Plates, no doubt.)
Stillen Flywheel is $450 shipped, friction ring plate when buying as a replacement is $130 shipped.
The Fidanza Flywheel is about $350-$370 shipped, replacing Friction ring plate is about $100 shipped.
Flywheel Geometry:
Stillen Flywheel has no ring gear attached to it, you'd have to use the factory ring gear. You'll also need to re-use the smaller ring clamp plate to bolt it onto the crank. It is basically a stock design with light alloys.
Fidanza Flywheel has welded ring gear attached, so there's no need for re-using the factory ring gear. You also won't need to re-use the smaller clamp plate.
Fidanza design simply eliminated the need of re-using any parts. Stillen has their flywheel cernter section designed at factory specifications which is about 1/8" thick, you'll need to attach the factory smaller clamp plate to bolt it onto the crank. The Fidanza flywheel design is a little bit different, the center section is beefed up further than Stillen and the factory designs that it is about 1/4" thick and it eliminates the use of the smaller clamp plate. I take serious note of this because my Stillen flywheel snapped in two pieces where the center section is. (Thats where the smaller clamp plate is needed to bolt it to the crank) Basically the center section and the outter section got separated due to torque induced fatigue. I examined and can tell it's a fatigue fracture, not bulk overload; besides, I was running N/A, how could I have overloaded that thing? But I do admit that I might have bolted the clamp down with a little over torque. I think this is pretty important for the rest of our flywheel "need to know" basis. Now the thickness of both flywheels are from my general memory of inspection. I didn't really go and measure them, but kinda remember the dimensions to the best of my knowledge. I did at once compare the two on both of my hands, obviously, the center plate of the fidanza is about 2-2.5 times thicker than the stillen's, but stillen re-uses the clamp plate to clear that difference. Overall, I induce that Fidanza would be stronger of the two.
But...I'll also add this info on here, this should also be in the stickies about the general flywheel specs: I own both Stillen and Fidanza Flywheels, and by comparison, this is what I've found:
Flywheel cost:
(Both Stillen and Fidanza flywheels have the replaceable friction Ring Plates, no doubt.)
Stillen Flywheel is $450 shipped, friction ring plate when buying as a replacement is $130 shipped.
The Fidanza Flywheel is about $350-$370 shipped, replacing Friction ring plate is about $100 shipped.
Flywheel Geometry:
Stillen Flywheel has no ring gear attached to it, you'd have to use the factory ring gear. You'll also need to re-use the smaller ring clamp plate to bolt it onto the crank. It is basically a stock design with light alloys.
Fidanza Flywheel has welded ring gear attached, so there's no need for re-using the factory ring gear. You also won't need to re-use the smaller clamp plate.
Fidanza design simply eliminated the need of re-using any parts. Stillen has their flywheel cernter section designed at factory specifications which is about 1/8" thick, you'll need to attach the factory smaller clamp plate to bolt it onto the crank. The Fidanza flywheel design is a little bit different, the center section is beefed up further than Stillen and the factory designs that it is about 1/4" thick and it eliminates the use of the smaller clamp plate. I take serious note of this because my Stillen flywheel snapped in two pieces where the center section is. (Thats where the smaller clamp plate is needed to bolt it to the crank) Basically the center section and the outter section got separated due to torque induced fatigue. I examined and can tell it's a fatigue fracture, not bulk overload; besides, I was running N/A, how could I have overloaded that thing? But I do admit that I might have bolted the clamp down with a little over torque. I think this is pretty important for the rest of our flywheel "need to know" basis. Now the thickness of both flywheels are from my general memory of inspection. I didn't really go and measure them, but kinda remember the dimensions to the best of my knowledge. I did at once compare the two on both of my hands, obviously, the center plate of the fidanza is about 2-2.5 times thicker than the stillen's, but stillen re-uses the clamp plate to clear that difference. Overall, I induce that Fidanza would be stronger of the two.
07-12-2006, 08:43 AM
#12
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1,183
You lose torque when going up inclines, but it isn't like you aren't going to make it up unless you tried to be like the crackpot a while ago who wanted to tow a boat with their max. Just imagine what happens when you go down steep DECLINES.
07-12-2006, 12:26 PM
#13
Originally Posted by nismology
My brother has the stillen flywheel on his s/c'ed 01 and it's been fine. I think the snapping issues you have are installer-related since no one else has it happen to them.
I agree with what ya saying here, but...
I am one of the rare ones who got to have both flywheels on the table and took a good look at both pieces. In fact, at the time, 2 Fidanza's and 1 Stillen because my brother was doing his 5-speed swap, and we whipped them all out to compare. I'm not saying "Don't use Stillen's". I'm just saying, for the price, and the flywheels' structural geomoetry, Stillen loses this battle in both worlds. I know at least 7 guys running with Stillen flywheels, and more than 10 guys running Fidanza's. Besides fitment issues on Pre or Post 95's, there's really no problems with both of them.
To clear things up, overtorqueing those bolts is just an assumption of who to blame because I didn't look up the torque requirements during the install, we were using the airtools and it wasn't on high torque settings either. The reason I assumed that is that I really don't think Stillen Flywheels are ever going to snap in pieces like this. I'm giving it credit enough, but Fidanza's physically got beefier thickness flywheels without much sacrifice of lightweightness.
07-13-2006, 10:46 AM
#14
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 282
i have the fidanza lightened flywheel in my max.
i dont regret having it in my car, and like other people before me posted, you have the replaceable friction inserts (when you order it you get 2 replacements!) the fact that you just replace the insert and dont have to resruface your flywheel wasnt a bad thing when i was gettign my new clutch and transmission done in jan.
rev matching in the car is so much faster than the stock flywheel and the car just wants to get up in the revs in each gear more willingly.
when shifting, you dont have to even think to wait for the flywheel to rev down for the next gear. combined with the short shifter i think it makes for a great driving experience!
i dont regret having it in my car, and like other people before me posted, you have the replaceable friction inserts (when you order it you get 2 replacements!) the fact that you just replace the insert and dont have to resruface your flywheel wasnt a bad thing when i was gettign my new clutch and transmission done in jan.
rev matching in the car is so much faster than the stock flywheel and the car just wants to get up in the revs in each gear more willingly.
when shifting, you dont have to even think to wait for the flywheel to rev down for the next gear. combined with the short shifter i think it makes for a great driving experience!
07-13-2006, 01:57 PM
#15
Originally Posted by NAPhi_Shift
i have the fidanza lightened flywheel in my max.
i dont regret having it in my car, and like other people before me posted, you have the replaceable friction inserts (when you order it you get 2 replacements!) the fact that you just replace the insert and dont have to resruface your flywheel wasnt a bad thing when i was gettign my new clutch and transmission done in jan.
rev matching in the car is so much faster than the stock flywheel and the car just wants to get up in the revs in each gear more willingly.
when shifting, you dont have to even think to wait for the flywheel to rev down for the next gear. combined with the short shifter i think it makes for a great driving experience!
i dont regret having it in my car, and like other people before me posted, you have the replaceable friction inserts (when you order it you get 2 replacements!) the fact that you just replace the insert and dont have to resruface your flywheel wasnt a bad thing when i was gettign my new clutch and transmission done in jan.
rev matching in the car is so much faster than the stock flywheel and the car just wants to get up in the revs in each gear more willingly.
when shifting, you dont have to even think to wait for the flywheel to rev down for the next gear. combined with the short shifter i think it makes for a great driving experience!
and if you want to part your car out holla at me.
07-13-2006, 02:23 PM
#16
You don't lose any torque going up/down/sideways/upside down/right side up.
What you "lose" up a hill, is some kinetic energy stored in the fllywheel. So during an upshift, the revs will drop faster vs a stock flywheel. But the faster you shift, the less rpm you lose. It's really just a matter of reving a few 100 rpm higher before shifting or just making a quicker shift.
Remember a flywheel is an energy storage device.
What you "lose" up a hill, is some kinetic energy stored in the fllywheel. So during an upshift, the revs will drop faster vs a stock flywheel. But the faster you shift, the less rpm you lose. It's really just a matter of reving a few 100 rpm higher before shifting or just making a quicker shift.
Remember a flywheel is an energy storage device.
Originally Posted by scrhale
You lose torque when going up inclines, but it isn't like you aren't going to make it up unless you tried to be like the crackpot a while ago who wanted to tow a boat with their max. Just imagine what happens when you go down steep DECLINES.
07-13-2006, 02:57 PM
#17
Member
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Montreal
Posts: 156
ok i know we dont see me much since im new and for some reason i cant post
but nways wat do u guys think about unorthodox racing flywheel, which is 5lbs? Is it a bit too light for daily driving?
http://www.ultrarev.com/Unorthodox_R...29-p27439.html
but nways wat do u guys think about unorthodox racing flywheel, which is 5lbs? Is it a bit too light for daily driving?http://www.ultrarev.com/Unorthodox_R...29-p27439.html
07-14-2006, 08:01 AM
#18
That thing is 5lbs without the ring gear and the center clamp plate. After you add those in, you'll hit about 9-10 lbs. After all, it's about 3-4 lbs light than the Fidanza's, which came fully manufactured with the ring gear and the clamp plate.
07-22-2006, 12:52 PM
#19
Member
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 47
Originally Posted by scrhale
You lose torque when going up inclines, but it isn't like you aren't going to make it up unless you tried to be like the crackpot a while ago who wanted to tow a boat with their max. Just imagine what happens when you go down steep DECLINES.
actually that was me that inquired about towing my boat with my max. it was a simple question. no real desire behind it. i just wanted the hear member opinions on the topic. and theoreticly, yes, you can pull a small boat with a max. its a matter of how long it would hold up to that abuse. there are many trucks that are lighter with less power pulling boats. and and as far as being a crackpot, get your facts right before posting. jeff is on the dot, all you loose is kinetic energy when shifting purely due to lack of weight on the flywheel to keep it spinning.
07-22-2006, 08:40 PM
#20
Originally Posted by YellowNinja
actually that was me that inquired about towing my boat with my max. it was a simple question. no real desire behind it. i just wanted the hear member opinions on the topic. and theoreticly, yes, you can pull a small boat with a max. its a matter of how long it would hold up to that abuse. there are many trucks that are lighter with less power pulling boats. and and as far as being a crackpot, get your facts right before posting. jeff is on the dot, all you loose is kinetic energy when shifting purely due to lack of weight on the flywheel to keep it spinning.
YellowNinja, the mods in your sig are EXACTALY how i want my car set up. how is it as a daily driver?
07-25-2006, 10:47 AM
#21
Member
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 47
Originally Posted by Blackwind
now play nice people.
YellowNinja, the mods in your sig are EXACTALY how i want my car set up. how is it as a daily driver?
YellowNinja, the mods in your sig are EXACTALY how i want my car set up. how is it as a daily driver?
07-25-2006, 01:45 PM
#22
Originally Posted by YellowNinja
actually that was me that inquired about towing my boat with my max. it was a simple question. no real desire behind it. i just wanted the hear member opinions on the topic. and theoreticly, yes, you can pull a small boat with a max. its a matter of how long it would hold up to that abuse. there are many trucks that are lighter with less power pulling boats. and and as far as being a crackpot, get your facts right before posting. jeff is on the dot, all you loose is kinetic energy when shifting purely due to lack of weight on the flywheel to keep it spinning.
Weight and power are only a couple of factors. you also need to take in mind chassis/frame design and suspension weight capacity.
I have no problem throwing 800lb of junk in the back of my hardbody truck. In fact, I've towed an 8,000lb trailer with it. it's got a crappy little KA24E in it with 150hp..
BUT, it's got a suspension designed for the load. the Maxima does not. the Maxima is desgined for something like a 2000 or 3000 lb towing capacity (see your owners manual). you're bolting a boat and a tow hitch to a pile of formed and spot-welded sheet metal.. NOT a steel frame rail chassis like what's in a truck.
It's not a matter of how long the engine and clutch will last when towing, it's a matter of how bad it's goign to bend the rear half of the unibody and blow out the shocks when you hit even a minor bump.
As for the flywheel, there's always a tradeoff... for track racing (road course, NOT drag racing), you want to go as light as possible. this allows the engine to rev faster and doesn't suck up all the power.. For drag racing, you want to go at least slightly heavier, as you'll need the mass of the flywheel to launch the car off the line. otherwise you bog the engine down and toast the clutch launching at 6000rpm.
for towing stuff (i.e. in a TRUCK), you want a really heavy flywheel to take some of the beating put on the drivetrain from the load, as well as to make starting off easier. remember you've got to get 15,000lb from a standstill to moving with only a couple hundred pounds of metal spinning under the hood. the heavier the flywheel, the easier that is.
07-25-2006, 08:53 PM
#23
Member
Join Date: May 2006
Posts: 47
Originally Posted by Matt93SE
Weight and power are only a couple of factors. you also need to take in mind chassis/frame design and suspension weight capacity.
I have no problem throwing 800lb of junk in the back of my hardbody truck. In fact, I've towed an 8,000lb trailer with it. it's got a crappy little KA24E in it with 150hp..
BUT, it's got a suspension designed for the load. the Maxima does not. the Maxima is desgined for something like a 2000 or 3000 lb towing capacity (see your owners manual). you're bolting a boat and a tow hitch to a pile of formed and spot-welded sheet metal.. NOT a steel frame rail chassis like what's in a truck.
It's not a matter of how long the engine and clutch will last when towing, it's a matter of how bad it's goign to bend the rear half of the unibody and blow out the shocks when you hit even a minor bump.
As for the flywheel, there's always a tradeoff... for track racing (road course, NOT drag racing), you want to go as light as possible. this allows the engine to rev faster and doesn't suck up all the power.. For drag racing, you want to go at least slightly heavier, as you'll need the mass of the flywheel to launch the car off the line. otherwise you bog the engine down and toast the clutch launching at 6000rpm.
for towing stuff (i.e. in a TRUCK), you want a really heavy flywheel to take some of the beating put on the drivetrain from the load, as well as to make starting off easier. remember you've got to get 15,000lb from a standstill to moving with only a couple hundred pounds of metal spinning under the hood. the heavier the flywheel, the easier that is.
I have no problem throwing 800lb of junk in the back of my hardbody truck. In fact, I've towed an 8,000lb trailer with it. it's got a crappy little KA24E in it with 150hp..
BUT, it's got a suspension designed for the load. the Maxima does not. the Maxima is desgined for something like a 2000 or 3000 lb towing capacity (see your owners manual). you're bolting a boat and a tow hitch to a pile of formed and spot-welded sheet metal.. NOT a steel frame rail chassis like what's in a truck.
It's not a matter of how long the engine and clutch will last when towing, it's a matter of how bad it's goign to bend the rear half of the unibody and blow out the shocks when you hit even a minor bump.
As for the flywheel, there's always a tradeoff... for track racing (road course, NOT drag racing), you want to go as light as possible. this allows the engine to rev faster and doesn't suck up all the power.. For drag racing, you want to go at least slightly heavier, as you'll need the mass of the flywheel to launch the car off the line. otherwise you bog the engine down and toast the clutch launching at 6000rpm.
for towing stuff (i.e. in a TRUCK), you want a really heavy flywheel to take some of the beating put on the drivetrain from the load, as well as to make starting off easier. remember you've got to get 15,000lb from a standstill to moving with only a couple hundred pounds of metal spinning under the hood. the heavier the flywheel, the easier that is.
People, just read what Matt has to say and make up your opinion on whether a lightweight flywheel is for you or not. he brings up some good facts.
04-08-2012, 09:54 PM
#25
Newbie - Just Registered
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Phila
Posts: 1
So guess it would be a bad idea having a lightweight flywheel and towing with it?? Was thinking about towing with my 98 maxima just got a seadoo and its about 800lbs with ski and trailer. Think its a bad idea? Also was going tow it for about 900miles. Thanks for the advice.
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