assiduous

Well, after going through all 65 pages of the rims megathread, I decided to make an alternative *mini* thread. Because there is actually another direction for changing stock wheels, and that is : going DOWN.
Here are some of the pros and cons to consider.
CONS:
-- looks. These do not look as aggressive, or sporty, or fast, or whatever you want to call it. I saw some really gorgeous 'fat' looking wheels in that megathread.
-- cornering/ steering. You have some extra sidewall that will flex if you push the car in the corners.

PROS:
-- Performance/Acceleration/Deceleration (braking). The wheels that I dismounted weighed exactly 57 lbs each, pumped up to 33 PSI. The replacements were 41 lbs, having exact same pressure. That is 64 lbs of *rotational weight*. People go long ways to save even 10 lbs of rotational weight. The 64 lbs savings is enormous. And on top of that, the distribution of those poinds is different -- the circumference of the rim on the lighter wheels (where the most weight is) is much closer to the center, and as result you need less torque to spin it. 50 pounds 19" from the center are much more difficult to spin thant 50 pounds 17" from the center. And the end of it, You WILL feel the car lighter and faster in the first 30 seconds of driving. It will just crack a grin on your face.
-- Comfort. The extra sidewall flex absorbs higher bumps much better.
-- Road noise. This one is actually due to me decreasing tire size as well, down to 225/55/17. My nissan is one really quiet car right now, all I hear on expressway is some wind.
-- Faster suspension recovery. You can read those articles about sprung/unsprung weight for better detail, but basically your suspension not only has to push your car up, but needs to push your wheels back down on the road. If you drive on uneven surface with a little higher speed, light wheels help the suspension keep them always connected tot he road. That one is a little counter intuitive, but going small can actually IMPROVE road feel.
-- Longer suspension LIFE/ tighter interior. I had some 19s with really thin tires on my 4th gem Maxima. I remember those two months. Thin sidewall made everything in the interior rattle and desintegrate. My panels started squeaking. I am sure I reduced the life of my shocks by some 10 000 miles as well. Lets be honest, low profile tires are not only heavy on the engine, but harsh on the suspension as well as interior build.

The question of traction under full acceleration. Firstly, a 2014 Accord w V6 will weigh exactly as my Maxima and will kill it on 0-60. Go drive one at the dealer, it will snap you neck. This is achieved with some 215/55/17 tires. So going down from 245 to 225 does not seem risky to me. Secondly, the narrow tires actually does not necessarily have less contact with the asphalt. If you analyze the shape of the contact area, you will see that the wide tires form something like a 245 by 20mm rectangular. The narrower tires have more pressure per mm of width, so they flex more and the rectangular is now something like 225 by 25mm. There are articles that explain that as well. It depends on the application as well, but suffice it to say, bigger wheels are not always better for acceleration grip, and the Accord is a good testimony to that.

Here are some picks of my car, and an idea of what your car may look with smaller wheels. These are ENKEI RACING SP01, 17 x 7, 48mm offset, with 225/55/17 Hankook tires. Ride is amazingly comfortable and quiet, car is light as the old 4th gen felt.

Maximam

Personally when selecting an aftermarket wheel, I go up in diameter but find a wheel that weights less than the factory wheel. I have been considering going with a 18" but wider like 9.5 wide to retain some sidewall for the potholes etc.

Either way Eibachs are in order.

zoemayne

iTrader: (4)

I've been thinking about getting thicker tires... the ride will just be smoother and softer. Does not look as bad as I thought especially if I black out the rims. Also I'm probably going to get the dealer to turn off the engine braking.

Check that out:

http://forums.maxima.org/7th-generat...aking-off.html

http://forums.maxima.org/7th-generat...-wheels-2.html

2010maxSV

you should of bought a Camry if you wanted comfort and quietness. The Max is more of a sportscar than a Sunday cruiser. While I get the weight savings aspect, I really dig the bigger wheels.

And personally, I love hearing my Borla on the highway. So road noise doesn't bother me.

zoemayne

iTrader: (4)

It's not about quietness its about the softer ride to me. I don't need to feel every piece of the road. You like to hear your Borla but I like to hear my music! Hearing the same thing gets boring fast.

ChrisMan287

iTrader: (34)

As long as you're happy

assiduous

[QUOTE=zoemayne;8939782]I've been thinking about getting thicker tires... the ride will just be smoother and softer. Does not look as bad as I thought especially if I black out the rims. Also I'm probably going to get the dealer to turn off the engine braking.

Check that out:

http://forums.maxima.org/7th-generat...aking-off.html



Thanks for posting this. I'm onto it now, expecially if its that cheap to get it done. I can always turn it back on.

Shipwreck

Bottom line

Make sure your calipers will clear (I've been told they did when trying 17" OEM G35 Sedan wheels).

Personally, I'd stick with 18s if not 19s, perhaps some lighter weighted wheel. I bought 19s but haven't mounted tires on them yet... perhaps I'll just sell those too...

assiduous

17's are well clear of the calipers, as you can see on the picture (full size available). I mean.. its not even close.

I thought about getting lighter 18s but I really wanted the the maximum weight savings to get the WOW effect. But its hard to find 18 x 7 wheels. The stock is 18 x 8 and is already an alloy wheel. The most expensive wheels out there will save you only a couple of pounds. And light wheels are EXPENSIVE.
I didn't want to spend 2000 on wheels/tires/sensors for only a couple of pounds of savings. Thats why I decided to cut 20mm from the tires (down to the 225 which is already larger than any other sedan). That allowed me to cut the rim from 8" to 7", which in itself is a weight saving, but remember that your tire will be be 20 mm lighter as well now. And then I went down to 17". The smaller rims have double positive effect on rotational weight savings - they are lighter because they are smaller, but the distribution of the weight itself is more favorable, because the weight of the rim is now closer to the center. And lastly, check Enkei racing and Motegi racing for some of the lightest wheels on the market. They not cheap, to be sure, but they of excellent quality. I had them on 4th gen Max for 10 years with no problems (i don't drive like crazy tho), and on a subaru legacy wagon for 5 years (I put light wheels on every car I own).

At the end of it all, even without the better distribution, I save 16 pounds per wheel. That is a good weight reduction even if u take it out of the trunk. But to shed off the wheels... your car is really gona thank you.

MaximaDrvr

iTrader: (1)

Maybe it is the fact that you aren't lowered at all, but the tires look a little undersized.
I have done the comparison, and know that they are the same OD though.
It does make your brakes look huge in comparison.

I may not like the look, but I can understand and appreciate what you did and everything it does for the car.

dr_2010SV

FYI...OEM 2009-2011 18's are manufactured by Enkei for Nissan.

Shipwreck

Mick7

How much difference did it make in acceleration...subjectively, of course?

assiduous

I can't quantify, but if you ever had 3 friends in the car and you drop them off.. the first few blocks you drive the car alone the car feels just so light and fast. It is similar feeling, that you just dropped off a big load.

I have less than 300 miles on the car and the manual says to keep it under 4 000 RPM, so I don't push it too hard. But even with the gas paddle depressed just and inch and the engine between 3K and 4K the car just flies forward when taking off traffic lights.

assiduous

The brakes are noticeably stronger now. To be honest, the brakes with the stock wheels feel a little underpowered. You have to really step into the brake paddle at the end. Now the car stops so easy, it builds confidence.

So far the only drawback is that these new sensors I got tell the computer that the tire pressure is too low, when all tires are exactly at 33 PSI. At 36 the warning disapears, but 36 makes a HUGE difference. I feel the small cracks on the pavement protrude through suspension and in the cabin. I don't like that. At 33, I tell you, my car drives like a lightning fast limo.
Hoping the dealer can adjust that at my appointment 9:00 am tomorrow when they turn off the cvt braking

D.Stillwell

33psi sounds too low for that car and those tires. I don't know how spirited of a driver you are but I can't keep any less than 36psi in my tires on my 5th gen or it rolls the edge in hard corners. And that's on a 5th gen with 17's which is way lighter car than 7th gen and with 225/50.

You need more air in those 215/55/17 on a 3600lbs car. 33psi is good for the OEM tires, not for those 17's plus with thicker sidewall.

Grego214

Great install on the lift kit.

assiduous

I had some problems with the aftermarket TPMS sensors, they would trigger a low pressure warning if less than 35 PSI. 35 was too rough for me. I hear this BRAM BRAM over even the shallowest road cracks.
I actually drive kind of fast around town, I enjoy maneuvering around cars and doing a brisk take off at stop lights. But this car was too heavy to be pushed around corners and avoid it.
Anyway, if you take a look at the midsize sedan family, the better engine versions, they all weigh ~ 3550 , have ~ 250HP, and cost around 30-32K. Maxima is the only one with these outrageous wheels, completely unwarranted in my opinion. That is one of the main reasons in my opinion for the car to be so slow on 0-60. 290HP should be at least as quick and the new accord, given the same weight, and its not really even close.
I wish the

dr_2010SV

Yeah 290hp with a good 6 speed auto (or the 6 speed manual/combo coupe) like the Accord's would make a big difference.
But you really need to remember you are comparing the new Accord to the six year old 7th generation Maxima.
Plus the new Accord doesn't even come close in the looks dept.... still.

assiduous

The new accord has an amazing automatic transmission. I have not seen something like this. With full throttle the shift is still super smooth and almost immediate. It is hard to believe until you try yourself. But the heavy wheels are a big drag. Tirerack did some studies on that where the change of weight was only a couple of pounds and still they recorded a significant change in performance.

assiduous

I finally see some drawback of the upgrade. I have Hankook S1 Noble tires, 225 mm wide instead of the stock 245. As I got about 550 miles on the car now I begin to push it more and more, though still don't go higher than 5000 RPM. But yesterday I made the fastest start yet, and even though it was a rolling start and not a complete stop start, my front wheels slipped and the car started hopping. I had to let go off the gas to regain traction. Traction control must have been off. Weird, i never touched it since I bought the car. But yeah, it will hop on you with 225s. Being honest with you.
Otherwise, as the tires are kind of broken in now, the ride is just S-class quiet. I am telling you, the car has very nice sound dampening and engine bay insulation, the whole noise comes from these 245 mm tires that nobody else in the class has.

assiduous

error post

1996blackmax

iTrader: (2)

This car has a slow start that is designed into it. The reason being the CVT. That is gone when you punch it when you already have a little speed built up.

As far as the car having issues being pushed around corners... That could be due to sidewall flex from you tires. I don't have that issue, granted I've upgraded some suspension parts, but tires also have something to do with this.

assiduous

20.0 MPG average exactly with the first tank. 100% suburban. 27.7 average. I don't even know if thats better than stock. I know my old 97 Max has been averaging 24-25 on this route to work for years, also with light wheels..

Silver4DSC

This is by far the strangest "let's be different" idea I've come across.

assiduous

the ride with these wheels and tires is phenomenal. Mercedes E class like. Zero tire and road noise, its unbelievable. Makes some wind noise from the mirror very obvious now.
The surprising thing to me was that despite the huge difference in how light the car feels, there seems to be no MPG improvement at all.

Shipwreck

It'd only really help regarding performance and handling, I'd think. If the tires themselves are rated to have less rolling resistance, that helps for mpgs, but only a bit. It's really all about pedal discipline.

1996blackmax

iTrader: (2)

I'll stick to quality tires & keep my 19 's on.

assiduous

Guys, i feel compelled to give you an update here on what is going on with this project.

If you remember, i am the guy who had, or thought he had engine bearing problem. I had some other issues with the car, mostly rattles and seat rocking. So I gave the car to my girlfriend and she has been driving the car almost exclusively in the last 12 months.

She travels from schaumburg IL to Crystal Lake IL every day, its a pretty good trip to work, it is suburban commute that is far from city traffic, although you do pass briefly through a few downtowns on the way.

She has been getting 24.9 MPG according to the car computer over the last 8 000 miles. This car has not even sniffed expressway. When I drove to work I was getting 21 mpg, in similar route, but i had just gotten the car and was punching it a lot.

My gf is an asian girl and she never speeds (horrible driver, those stereotypes didn't come out from nothing), and picks up another girl on the way. So her driving style is very different than mine. But still, for a 3600 lb car with such big engine to be gettin almost 25 mpg, is suburbs, i find that amazing. SHe used to do exactly that with her old 4 cyl Camry 1999! That camry had 4 speed auto trans and din't like suburban traffic too much.

assiduous

So I have no choice but to be convinced that shaving 15 pounds per wheel for a total of 60 lbs of rotational mass had a pretty significant effect on my car.
And this will sound cocky, but I think on a quarter mile i can beat everybody with a loud ghetto muffler tho think his car is faster now.

So, if anybody is thinking about going this route... i just can't imagine you being disapointed. More comfort, quieter, more powerful and better fuel economy. I don't think a 17" look that bad on my car either!

assiduous

one last note... in case anybody ends in my situation...
WHen I bought the car, a part of the incentive package was a free set of replacement tires. up to 600$ total, dealer prices.
The dealer told me that now they will not give me replacement tires since i changed original wheels/tires. Don't know what the logic is.. but if you have that deal too - you need to think it through.