How long do you let your car warm up in the morning?
: 
02-24-2008, 02:42 PM
#85
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Upland CA
Posts: 7,353
Interesting article here with comments at the end:
http://www.terrapass.com/blog/posts/conservation-ti-2
http://www.terrapass.com/blog/posts/conservation-ti-2
02-24-2008, 02:48 PM
#86
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: a meadow south of Atlanta
Posts: 8,143
'Idling is bad, and warming up your car is unnecessary'
Excellent article with sound advice. Thanks, Deus.
The only time I could see warming the engine somewhat before driving is if the temp is very cold, if there is snow/ice on the vehicle, or if one will have to climb a fairly steep street or be getting on a fast road/freeway withing minutes of beginning your trip.
In all cases, whether warming the vehicle by idling or not, the key is to drive gently until the engine is fully warmed up.
Excellent article with sound advice. Thanks, Deus.
The only time I could see warming the engine somewhat before driving is if the temp is very cold, if there is snow/ice on the vehicle, or if one will have to climb a fairly steep street or be getting on a fast road/freeway withing minutes of beginning your trip.
In all cases, whether warming the vehicle by idling or not, the key is to drive gently until the engine is fully warmed up.
Last edited by lightonthehill; 02-24-2008 at 03:07 PM.
02-24-2008, 02:55 PM
#87
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Upland CA
Posts: 7,353
My pleasure. I wanted to say that in light of the recommendations, the comment about gaskets, differing metals, different fluids, and the fact that motors tend to waste more fuel cold than warm are legitimate factors. Any comments on that?
02-24-2008, 03:14 PM
#88
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: a meadow south of Atlanta
Posts: 8,143
Engine components, lubricants, etc, must be warmed up completely before the engine will run efficiently (an efficient engine reduces emmisions), and that complete warmup will be accomplished much more quickly by driving than by sitting idling. In fact, idling does nothing to warm up components such as tires, shocks, any suspension parts.
The key is to drive very gently right after starting the car, and continue somewhat gently until full warmup has been reached.
The key is to drive very gently right after starting the car, and continue somewhat gently until full warmup has been reached.
Great article and I vote sticky...just clean up pages 2-3 
02-25-2008, 05:05 PM
#91
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Upland CA
Posts: 7,353
The only issue I have with emissions is that engines nowadays burn soooo clean that does it really make a difference whether u idle or not with respect to emissions output out of the tailpipe?
02-25-2008, 09:48 PM
#94
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: a meadow south of Atlanta
Posts: 8,143
I'm no scientist (at least not an automotive scientist), but whenever I get out of my car to pick up the newspaper after having only driven the 300 feet down the driveway from the garage to the street and the engine is cold, the fumes coming from the exhaust are very pungent and unpleasant.
After driving until the engine is fully warm, when I get out and walk around the car with the engine running, the exhaust seems to have much less odor. I have always attributed this to a warmed-up engine running more efficiently, as well as a fully warm exhaust system being better at handling emmissions.
At any rate, I can't let the car idle before moving the car, as the garage and tool rooms are heated and cooled and totally insulated, and we almost never have the doors open except fifteen seconds or so as we leave/arrive. Our drive is very level, as are the streets around here, so the careful warming of our Maxima while driving is the only sensible approach for us.
After driving until the engine is fully warm, when I get out and walk around the car with the engine running, the exhaust seems to have much less odor. I have always attributed this to a warmed-up engine running more efficiently, as well as a fully warm exhaust system being better at handling emmissions.
At any rate, I can't let the car idle before moving the car, as the garage and tool rooms are heated and cooled and totally insulated, and we almost never have the doors open except fifteen seconds or so as we leave/arrive. Our drive is very level, as are the streets around here, so the careful warming of our Maxima while driving is the only sensible approach for us.
02-26-2008, 01:42 PM
#97
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: a meadow south of Atlanta
Posts: 8,143
My driveway is shorter than my surrounding neighbors. My home sits near the front of our seven acre lot (zoning minimum here is five acres). But my neighbor to the north has 28 acres (and several horses) and my neighbor to the west has 134 acres (and over a hundred head of cattle). I'm the poor man in a rich area. For city dwellers who may ask, an acre is 43,560 square feet.
Depending on location, view, etc, land around here (easy commuting distance from Atlanta) sells for from $15K an acre for larger lots to over $100K an acre for one acre homesites, but because of zoning restrictions, my lot can't be split. So I alternate between glancing at my '00 SE and '04 SL (can't wash them; water restrictions) and toiling endlessly to maintain our property. Living on a farm is not the idyllic life some would lead you to believe. Having trucks, mowers, chain saws, gas fueled trimmers, gas fueled edgers, etc (which need constant maintenance) is mandatory. I could use a few extra hands that are good with a post hole digger this month . . .
We will eventually move to a home in a rural subdivision where the lots are one or two acres, and the land is left wooded (no lawn; no hours of mowing, etc). Then it will truly be Maxima time!
Well, time to return to surfing the web, seeking spy shots of the 7th gen Maxima.
Depending on location, view, etc, land around here (easy commuting distance from Atlanta) sells for from $15K an acre for larger lots to over $100K an acre for one acre homesites, but because of zoning restrictions, my lot can't be split. So I alternate between glancing at my '00 SE and '04 SL (can't wash them; water restrictions) and toiling endlessly to maintain our property. Living on a farm is not the idyllic life some would lead you to believe. Having trucks, mowers, chain saws, gas fueled trimmers, gas fueled edgers, etc (which need constant maintenance) is mandatory. I could use a few extra hands that are good with a post hole digger this month . . .
We will eventually move to a home in a rural subdivision where the lots are one or two acres, and the land is left wooded (no lawn; no hours of mowing, etc). Then it will truly be Maxima time!
Well, time to return to surfing the web, seeking spy shots of the 7th gen Maxima.
02-26-2008, 04:52 PM
#99
NINE-time Maxima Owner
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Charlotte
Posts: 680
My driveway is shorter than my surrounding neighbors. My home sits near the front of our seven acre lot (zoning minimum here is five acres). But my neighbor to the north has 28 acres (and several horses) and my neighbor to the west has 134 acres (and over a hundred head of cattle). I'm the poor man in a rich area. For city dwellers who may ask, an acre is 43,560 square feet.
Depending on location, view, etc, land around here (easy commuting distance from Atlanta) sells for from $15K an acre for larger lots to over $100K an acre for one acre homesites, but because of zoning restrictions, my lot can't be split. So I alternate between glancing at my '00 SE and '04 SL (can't wash them; water restrictions) and toiling endlessly to maintain our property. Living on a farm is not the idyllic life some would lead you to believe. Having trucks, mowers, chain saws, gas fueled trimmers, gas fueled edgers, etc (which need constant maintenance) is mandatory. I could use a few extra hands that are good with a post hole digger this month . . .
We will eventually move to a home in a rural subdivision where the lots are one or two acres, and the land is left wooded (no lawn; no hours of mowing, etc). Then it will truly be Maxima time!
Well, time to return to surfing the web, seeking spy shots of the 7th gen Maxima.
Depending on location, view, etc, land around here (easy commuting distance from Atlanta) sells for from $15K an acre for larger lots to over $100K an acre for one acre homesites, but because of zoning restrictions, my lot can't be split. So I alternate between glancing at my '00 SE and '04 SL (can't wash them; water restrictions) and toiling endlessly to maintain our property. Living on a farm is not the idyllic life some would lead you to believe. Having trucks, mowers, chain saws, gas fueled trimmers, gas fueled edgers, etc (which need constant maintenance) is mandatory. I could use a few extra hands that are good with a post hole digger this month . . .
We will eventually move to a home in a rural subdivision where the lots are one or two acres, and the land is left wooded (no lawn; no hours of mowing, etc). Then it will truly be Maxima time!
Well, time to return to surfing the web, seeking spy shots of the 7th gen Maxima.
02-27-2008, 07:40 AM
#100
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Upland CA
Posts: 7,353
I'd really like to see a neutral evaluation regarding warm up procedures. I always consider bias when someone gives an opinion. I dont trust Nissan's recommendations. For example, Nissan recommends oil changes at 7500 miles and I dont know anyone who would wait that long to change the oil. Nissan also recommends tire pressure of 32 pounds. I would never run mine under 38 psi. Im not sure I trust the EPA either. The EPA looks good when there is less pollution, so of course they are going to recommend no idling.
My gut tells me that a short idle period is a good balance of allowing unlike metals, gaskets, fluids and such to get flowing and start to warm up. By short idle period, I mean a minute, maybe 2 in 40 degree temps or more and maybe 3-4 for sub freezing temps. I think this would provide a good balance of all relevant factors. I also believe that driving under 3,000 rpms is important until the car is fully warmed up.
My gut tells me that a short idle period is a good balance of allowing unlike metals, gaskets, fluids and such to get flowing and start to warm up. By short idle period, I mean a minute, maybe 2 in 40 degree temps or more and maybe 3-4 for sub freezing temps. I think this would provide a good balance of all relevant factors. I also believe that driving under 3,000 rpms is important until the car is fully warmed up.
02-27-2008, 08:17 AM
#101
I change my oil at 7500. Just because that's the most "conservative Nissan" accepts. Once warranty is up my Mobil1 will go 10k.
Plenty of UOAs support synthetic can go way beyond the 3k mark. And many people use OCIs of 5k, 10k etc.
IF there was a conspiracy for Nissan or others to give bad advice on maintaining your car (either to make money on service, or have it die quicker so you re-buy): 1 they run a huge risk of being disproven by 20/20, or anyone else destroying their name, 2 have no guarantee you will seek their privately owed, non-affiliated, Nissan named dealers for service, and 3 know you will likely change brands if your car does not perform as expected.
Though their conservative view on 3750 and 7500 OCIs are based on older oils and roughest driving conditions, I trust they have their products' performance in their best interest. So I followed the manuals break-in procedure (though I went extra conservative and switched the OEM oil out at 1k) and will follow the 1 min idle suggestion when cold.
Warming up uniformly and saving gas money makes more sense to me than a few components getting hot while others remain cold. 5W-30 oil is designed to run warm and cold. No reason to "warm the oil so it flows." I have yet to meet a single mechanic that will tell you to idle a car to warm it.
Plenty of UOAs support synthetic can go way beyond the 3k mark. And many people use OCIs of 5k, 10k etc.
IF there was a conspiracy for Nissan or others to give bad advice on maintaining your car (either to make money on service, or have it die quicker so you re-buy): 1 they run a huge risk of being disproven by 20/20, or anyone else destroying their name, 2 have no guarantee you will seek their privately owed, non-affiliated, Nissan named dealers for service, and 3 know you will likely change brands if your car does not perform as expected.
Though their conservative view on 3750 and 7500 OCIs are based on older oils and roughest driving conditions, I trust they have their products' performance in their best interest. So I followed the manuals break-in procedure (though I went extra conservative and switched the OEM oil out at 1k) and will follow the 1 min idle suggestion when cold.
Warming up uniformly and saving gas money makes more sense to me than a few components getting hot while others remain cold. 5W-30 oil is designed to run warm and cold. No reason to "warm the oil so it flows." I have yet to meet a single mechanic that will tell you to idle a car to warm it.
Last edited by NismoMax80; 02-27-2008 at 08:19 AM.
02-27-2008, 02:37 PM
#103
Interesting article here with comments at the end:
http://www.terrapass.com/blog/posts/conservation-ti-2
http://www.terrapass.com/blog/posts/conservation-ti-2
02-27-2008, 09:25 PM
#104
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: toronto
Posts: 371
question for anyone
when turning on the ignition to first position.. four beeps are heard in the max.... I was once told my a mechanic that this is the time for the fuel pump (and other electronics).. to turn on/work properly/ warm up (this was on another car) ....
anyone knows why, ......most cars do this -- i.e. four beeps..and it is abt 5 secs
when turning on the ignition to first position.. four beeps are heard in the max.... I was once told my a mechanic that this is the time for the fuel pump (and other electronics).. to turn on/work properly/ warm up (this was on another car) ....
anyone knows why, ......most cars do this -- i.e. four beeps..and it is abt 5 secs
02-28-2008, 01:29 AM
#105
question for anyone
when turning on the ignition to first position.. four beeps are heard in the max.... I was once told my a mechanic that this is the time for the fuel pump (and other electronics).. to turn on/work properly/ warm up (this was on another car) ....
anyone knows why, ......most cars do this -- i.e. four beeps..and it is abt 5 secs
when turning on the ignition to first position.. four beeps are heard in the max.... I was once told my a mechanic that this is the time for the fuel pump (and other electronics).. to turn on/work properly/ warm up (this was on another car) ....
anyone knows why, ......most cars do this -- i.e. four beeps..and it is abt 5 secs
Kamski
02-28-2008, 08:39 PM
#106
Modern cars do not need to idle and warm up to operate effectively beyond just 10 to 15 seconds. If you fear your cold climate, go with 5-30 or 0-30 weight oils so they will be less viscous during the cold and lubricate the engine sooner.
Idling for five minutes a day in a small car will burn over 8 gallons of gas a year and release 88 kilograms of carbon dioxide. The 3.5 liter VQ will probably burn/produce twice that.
Catalytic converters do work best when warmed up but warm up best by being driven!
Idling for more than 10 seconds releases more greenhouse gases than cutting the motor and starting again. Idling for more than 45 seconds (at a train crossing for example) wastes more fuel and causes more engine wear than cutting the motor and starting again.
Idling for five minutes a day in a small car will burn over 8 gallons of gas a year and release 88 kilograms of carbon dioxide. The 3.5 liter VQ will probably burn/produce twice that.
Catalytic converters do work best when warmed up but warm up best by being driven!
Idling for more than 10 seconds releases more greenhouse gases than cutting the motor and starting again. Idling for more than 45 seconds (at a train crossing for example) wastes more fuel and causes more engine wear than cutting the motor and starting again.
02-29-2008, 01:26 AM
#107
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: a meadow south of Atlanta
Posts: 8,143
tubells and kamilkluczewski - The four beeps we hear during the first five seconds after we turn on the ignition are not telling us the fuel pump is primed and the lines are pressurized; they are reminding us to buckle our seatbelt. If you don't believe it, have the seat belt ready, then turn on the ignition and immediately buckle your belt. The instant you buckle your belt, the beeping stops.
This has been true of several generations of Maximas, as well as my wife's trucks.
This has been true of several generations of Maximas, as well as my wife's trucks.
03-05-2008, 08:06 PM
#112
I'd really like to see a neutral evaluation regarding warm up procedures. I always consider bias when someone gives an opinion. I dont trust Nissan's recommendations. For example, Nissan recommends oil changes at 7500 miles and I dont know anyone who would wait that long to change the oil. Nissan also recommends tire pressure of 32 pounds. I would never run mine under 38 psi. Im not sure I trust the EPA either. The EPA looks good when there is less pollution, so of course they are going to recommend no idling.
03-05-2008, 09:01 PM
#113
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: toronto
Posts: 371
tubells and kamilkluczewski - The four beeps we hear during the first five seconds after we turn on the ignition are not telling us the fuel pump is primed and the lines are pressurized; they are reminding us to buckle our seatbelt. If you don't believe it, have the seat belt ready, then turn on the ignition and immediately buckle your belt. The instant you buckle your belt, the beeping stops.
This has been true of several generations of Maximas, as well as my wife's trucks.
This has been true of several generations of Maximas, as well as my wife's trucks.
loh... will try that tomorrow..... altho i am sure i buckle myself in before putting in the key!!...
also... i have tried this.... put the key in and turned to first step... then gone near the rear of the car (close to the fuel door) ...and i could hear sounds of the fuel pump .. (what am i hearing here? <-- i know this is tempting for a sillly answer..but pls. and thks.)
03-06-2008, 01:57 PM
#114
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Westchester, NY
Posts: 106
I leave him warming up about 10 minutes.
I run out in the morning after a shower and turn him on then run back inside and leave him running while I get ready for work. If it's cold out I leave the heat on full blast.
I run out in the morning after a shower and turn him on then run back inside and leave him running while I get ready for work. If it's cold out I leave the heat on full blast.
03-06-2008, 04:29 PM
#115
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: toronto
Posts: 371
LoH.. you're right as usual... tried it this evening ...had my buckle in before turning the key... and no beeps!!
03-10-2008, 06:19 PM
#117
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Florida
Posts: 607
I am curious to know the average mpg of people who warm their cars for more than 10 mins every morning. While idling, the car gets 0 mpg.
Given the sky high price of gas, I certainly feel proud that I own a car also owned by a number of so rich people
Given the sky high price of gas, I certainly feel proud that I own a car also owned by a number of so rich people
03-10-2008, 06:24 PM
#118
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Staten Island,NY
Posts: 700
hahaha ^^^^^ anyway i know all of you guys are worried ab8 your engine not reaching proper temps but what ab8 the tranny?? trannies fail on cars more than engines do. and my mechanic told me that it is really bad to drive a car when its cold and not at operating temps. i still think its a good idea to warm up your car especially owners like me who has more than 1ook of miles on their cars.
03-10-2008, 06:53 PM
#120
Wink. I'll do the rest.
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Coral Springs, FL
Posts: 860
LOL ^^^
I do something similar. I have my car connected with my alarm clock via wireless connection. As soon as the alarm clock goes off at 6:30 am my car turns on automatically.... by the time I leave the house at 8 am it is also nice and warm
I do something similar. I have my car connected with my alarm clock via wireless connection. As soon as the alarm clock goes off at 6:30 am my car turns on automatically.... by the time I leave the house at 8 am it is also nice and warm