036mtmax

iTrader: (11)

Hey guys i finally hit my 15 posts so im kind of happy to be able to post this but at the same time aggrivated so here it is.The past couple weeks ive noticed sometimes especially cold mornings my car doesn't shift smooth into second gear and some times first,the car has 62k miles on it now and have been running Redline MT-90 in it for about 2 months now,I also did the STS mod and ES shifter bushings.Now im not sure if anyone maybe recommends Amsoil or Motul for extreme weather or not.The clutch fluid is full and i bled it for the heck of it,i checked linkage and everything looks ok.And its not a mount because it does it stationary too.Any insight to what it may be.Im thinking bad hydrolics or that MT-90 isnt cutting it,Some people say they have more luck with the amsoil.Any help would be greatly appreciated,Thanks

Shift_Max

iTrader: (18)

Mt-90 helps the problem but does not fix it. And the problem is the synchro in the trans. Nissan fixed this issue with the 6th gen maxima that were manual.
BTW you can search here on the forum. There are plenty of topics about this issue.

Rochester

iTrader: (3)

He didn't say it crunched into gear, he just said it wasn't smooth when cold. Which is normal, and exasperated by the loss of leverage with the STS.

My first-second shifts, and second-first downshifts, are really difficult when it's freezing outside and the car hasn't warmed up yet. It only takes a minute or two before things are fine.

If this is your situation, OP, then patience is all you need.

TallTom

I agree with Rochester.

Also, Redline just came out with a new transaxle formula better designed for our cars. I believe it's a little thinner in viscosity which may help cold shifts a small bit better.

http://www.amazon.com/Red-Line-Oil-M...6829358&sr=8-1

TunerMaxima3000

iTrader: (4)

^This + This:

= Good advice


I read it the same as Rochester, not sure why you posted 'crunch' in the title? This sounds like normal 2nd Gear Synchro issues to me, as stated, the oil is not going to fix this problem, neither is anything else you mentioned, unless your issue is with all gears at all times.

Double clutching when cold will help ease gear transition. If it bothers you that much or becomes a great issue you have to pull the tranny to fix it.

sparks03max

iTrader: (7)

Double clutching won't help any more than rev matching properly.

It is normal for our transmissions to feel stiff when really cold before it's had time to warm up. Especially first and second gears. I recently got a nearly brand new transmission after the original blew up and it is still stiff on cold mornings until warmed up.

TunerMaxima3000

iTrader: (4)

That's true but messing with precise rev-matching usually causes more clutch wear and increased fuel mileage.
That is, of course, in 'most' drivers, a professional driver would disagree, but lets face it, most of us are not professional drivers.

sparks03max

iTrader: (7)

You should be rev matching when you double clutch anyway... It is not hard at all to rev match when shifting. I don't see why you need to be a professional, it's just one of those things that any proficient manual transmission driver gets used to. I definitely don't consider myself a professional and I rev match every shift to reduce wear on the syncros pretty much subconsciously at this point.

TunerMaxima3000

iTrader: (4)

We are just looking at it a different way.
I'm considering rev-matching to be exact (exact match within 100 RPM).

If you watch your tach as you 'rev-match' I can almost guarantee you that it will skip around a bit, it may feel like you're matched up, but that's just cause of the sychros doing their job.

I don't know anyone who can rev-match right on the money every time, that my friend is not an easy thing, hence the professional driver comment.

If you've ever driven a vehicle without synchros you will have a better understanding of the point I'm trying to make.

Double clutching basically rev-matches for you to some extent, I don't think it will make a really noticable difference in his case though, just an idea. I found it helped on the really cold mornings when the hydraulics and linkages were stiff on my 5spd.


-Matt

sparks03max

iTrader: (7)

As long as you're getting close, the synchros take up the slack very easily, even when cold. Although I do understand the "point" you're trying to make, this isn't a vehicle without synchros after all. My "point" is that it's a bit silly to tell the OP to double clutch when he probably wants it to be easier, not more complicated.

TunerMaxima3000

iTrader: (4)

Good point.

knight_yyz

iTrader: (40)

I've used all the synthetics in my car, and the best one for cold weather is the Motyl 75w80. Last week we had -30C with the windchill and it still shifted like it was summer. The amsoil and the redline stuff don't come close when it's cold out

Eirik

iTrader: (2)

That's why you should try the MT-85 that someone else linked to. It only came out this past September. It's sitting in my basement right now, waiting for a warm enough day to swap it in.

036mtmax

iTrader: (11)

Sorry guys i should have clarified the title a little better its more like you just have to give it a bit of a tug to get it to go into second.Then when its at normal operating temp it either has a little bit of a stiffer shift but the next shift will be smooth as silk.Im really a meticulous basterd when it comes to clutches and trannies and its just kind of annoying.im gonna try to swap the sts back to the factory pin tonight and see what it does in the morning.maybe its the linkage but i didn't see anything wrong with it.I give up lol,drive it till it breaks and then fix as needed i guess ?btw knight motul says on there website that stuff is designed for notchy transmissions.and shift max the funny thing is the car shifted worse and started having this problem after i put the mt-90 in it.never had a problem before.thats why i asked about the amsoil and the motul :0

exandr

iTrader: (3)

Haven't been too active lately. BUT I'M ON NOW!!!

I put the Redline MT-90 in my tranny as well and my car now has that "crunch" when I shift. I live in Panama City Beach FL and the weather down here doesn't get that cold to where it affects the shifting. Although it is rather chilly out.

So is that MT-85 whats up? If so...I just went to Lowe's and picked up the pin for the STS mod, I've ordered the ES Bushings, I'm about to order my Stillen Intake Kit tonight, and the block plate after Aaron gets back from the wedding. So, while I'm at it...I might as well get this crappy MT-90 out of my car...if it really is crappy ya dig.

BTW...I'm the 3rd owner and I'm reviving my Max. The guy before me didn't know what he had and he didn't neccessarily dog it out, but he didn't "pamper" it. It now has 112k miles on it. No mods yet besides the foglight rewire and 8k HIDs. I've really only done routine things to it...oil, plugs, belts, tranny fluid, Tokico struts are all sitting at the crib awaiting the arrival of a lower ball joint and Moog mounts.

Feedback...

Rochester

iTrader: (3)

That's what I thought you meant after reading the first post.

Having the STS means you've lost some leverage pulling on the shifter. It's not so much that you would notice when things are warmed up, but when it's seriously cold out... yeah, it will be stiff going first to second.

Undo the STS for winter, or just deal with it until things warm up.

TunerMaxima3000

iTrader: (4)

So are you saying you insalled a REAL STS or just lowered the shifter? If you just lowered the shifter that's going to make your shifts much harder.
I've heard better things about Amsoil than Redline, but that was back when I did my research a few years ago.

EDIT: Rochester beat me to it

Rochester

iTrader: (3)

On the 5.5, the STS just moves your cable connection point, whether you use a kit or just tap and drill. It's a different configuration than in your AE.

Real... make-believe... call it what you want. The shifter throw is shortened.

TunerMaxima3000

iTrader: (4)

Oh cool, I've never heard of that type of set up. I'll have to look into it thanks for the lesson man!

Feel free to disregard what I said

mrjones

MOTYL 75W-80 and 75W-90 is GL4 AND GL5. Should probably stay away from that stuff. The gear oils recommended for our trannys is GL4 only.

JonBlz

iTrader: (11)

was the reviews on that motyl gear oil cause thats the first time i hear about that

036mtmax

iTrader: (11)

Rochester I see what your saying about the sts so what im going to do is put the amsoil in today just for s#%ts and gigs and see how it shifts in the morning and if it still doesn't shift right in the morning we know its probably not fluid.then ill pull the sts and try that,ill keep you guys posted on how it turns out thanks for all your input.

cmax1

Correct, im a truck driver and i have to upshift and downshift all day long and i dont rev-match right all the time. I say i do it right 85% of the time. Its also the same in a truck when its cold outside that you cannot get the shifter into the gear smoothly. Just let the car warm up for about 10 min and within the first 2 miles of driving things will get better.

gdal

iTrader: (2)

I noticed a drastic difference in cold weather shifting when I changed my fluid to Amsoil GL-4.

sparks03max

iTrader: (7)

You know I tried and tried to make myself use a STS... Used it for months, several track visits, missing gears constantly. At this point, I haven't used a STS in over a year... find that the increased effort just isn't worth it over the longer throw. Guess it depends on what your purpose for the car is and such, but very fast shifting doesn't do too well (at least for me) with the STS. It was nice daily driving, though. Can put your elbow on the arm wrest and move your wrist to shift.

Anything that shortens the throw has the side effect of increasing the effort by decreasing the leverage.

036mtmax

iTrader: (11)

Well all I can say is I just swapped out the redline for the amsoil about 20 minutes ago and took it for a spin and all I can say is I wished i had put this stuff in my car the day I bought it.It shifts like it did before I did the sts.the first 1 to 2 shift after putting it in I noticed it.much smoother.i highly recommend it.didnt even feel my intermitent 3rd gear notchy shift.tomorrow morning ill take it for a blast but for now at normal operating temp I must say its the best 40 bucks Ive spent on it.

TunerMaxima3000

iTrader: (4)

That may be true in a 5.5 cable set up, I don't know, but in a standard mechanical link set up (5spd), that's not true. Real STS's change the pivot point, so they shorten the shifter length without affecting the leverage.

TunerMaxima3000

iTrader: (4)

Glad to hear you have found somewhat of a solution, hope it works out for you.

I heard this argument so many years back Redling VS. Amsoil, and Amsoil always won on paper, as well as anyone who had Redline and switched to Amsoil or vise-versa preferred Amsoil (usually a seat-of-your-pants dyno, but nonetheless relevant to some degree). I did a lot of research before I chose Amsoil.

P.S. I'm not positive but IIRC GL-5 is fine to use in GL-4 trannies, just not the other way around.
Same as brake fluid, you can use a higher number, just not a lower one, as the new formula is made to accomodate all the past requirements, someone please correct if I'm wrong.

sparks03max

iTrader: (7)

Changing the pivot point also increases or reduces leverage depending on the direction that you move the pivot. Total effort to switch the gear is maintained regardless of throw, so it must be true that a shorter throw will require more effort per distance than a longer throw, regardless of how the change in throw was made.

If you need an example, consider a see-saw (make the see-saw itself weightless and your goal to be lifting a weight on the other side, for the sake of this example). Let's say it is 6 feet long, you are on the right side and a 30 pound weight is on the left side. If the pivot is 1 foot away from that weight, and 5 feet away from you, it will require a long throw but will be very easy for you to lift it. Now if the pivot is 5 feet from the weight, and 1 foot from you, it will be a very short throw but will be more difficult to move. Either way, the 30 pound weight is moving and the same amount of energy must be expended to move it, but due to the change in pivot point, the leverage and throw are inversely changed.

Rochester

iTrader: (3)

^^^
In theory, yes. But with a mechanical aftermarket linkage, this added effort isn't measurable in a way that makes any difference.

sparks03max

iTrader: (7)

It's not always noticeable, especially on a transmission that shifts smoothly and doesn't require much effort in the first place, but that doesn't change the fact that the transmission requires the same amount of force to change the gear either way... shortening the throw reduces leverage, period. But hey, let's just abandon basic physics and pretend that isn't the case. I'm down.

Rochester

iTrader: (3)

Nothing makes a point as well as debating the finer details of an irrelevant fact.

Most intake discussions go that route. Right away, too.

TallTom

Which Redline did you buy? The MT-90 or the new MT-85?

sparks03max

iTrader: (7)

You have probably noticed by now that I tend to jump on misinformation. When someone makes an off topic response stating that physics no longer apply if it's in "so they shorten the shifter throw without affecting the leverage" type of situations, you can be certain I will have something to say. If anything because I like to argue.

Rochester

iTrader: (3)

Your argument is with TunerMaxima, not me. I've already said the STS reduces leverage. Said it twice, in fact. Quite clearly, too.

All I'm saying is that it doesn't matter... until it does, like when it's freezing cold out and your tranny fluid hasn't warmed up.

036mtmax

iTrader: (11)

Mt-90

TunerMaxima3000

iTrader: (4)

Firstly, you're right, of course.

A true mechanical STS shortens the 'see-saw' overall length, moving the pivot point down to a point that creates as close as possible to the same ratio.

Example: Stock Shifter is 8" on one side of the pivot and 2" on the other side.
STS Shifter is 4" on one side of the pivot and 1" on the other side.

The ratio is the same = 4:1 but the shifter is shorter. So physics apply obviously.
The SAME amount of force is needed for both shifters above, but one is shorter.

Most STS have a lower ratio than stock to achieve a shorter throw as well as a shorter shifter, so of course you're correct, but on average leverage is not greatly affected by it. I'll be more precise next time for you

Now that we've jumped way off topic... back to the thread.

knight_yyz

iTrader: (40)

You only have to stay away from gl-5's that use sulphur. Motyl is safe. My mechanic races a sentra spec V on weekends and he has the same internals as we do. He's been using and abusing it for years with no problems.

sparks03max

iTrader: (7)

So you're talking about reducing height without reducing the throw, then? I just don't see how that was relevant to anything in the discussion, since I was specifically talking about reducing throw when you made your comment in reply to me. Just to reiterate more simply, STS=Short Throw Shifter was the topic of discussion.

In any case, said topic quickly became off topic after rochesters and my own points about the troubles of STS in the cold and otherwise were thrown into a mechanical lever height discussion, so I'll leave it to get back to gear oil talk before tunermaxima informs me that STS actually means "Short Tallness Shifter"

Rochester

iTrader: (3)

Lump me into your ramblings if you want, Sparks. But I was on topic.

I think you have last-word issues. (Oops! Off topic again.)