2slow

iTrader: (6)

And therein lies the rub. I don't believe any of the commonly available coilovers are equal to some of the stand-alone damper options.

Just like everything else in life, people value different things. You value the adjustability of a coilover whereas I value damping.

Not all non-coilovers options have this problem, which can also be compensated for with different bump stops.

I forgot the supa-fly jdm coilovers have a seperate ride height adjustment. Few non-jdm (or jdm knock-off) coilovers feature this adjustment since it's not dramatically different than adjusting the perches; ultimately suspension travel is limited by tire/body interference.

The jdm style dampers generally use too little compression damping with excessive rebound damping. These coilovers' damping curves are generally linear meaning harsh ride/load transfer over bumps (high speed), with insufficient body control (low speed). Furthermore, the adjustments generally solely affect high speed damping which is meaningless in road handling (low speed); basically you get more or less ride harshness.

2slow

iTrader: (6)

Another point, at ~$400 total the strut mount balljoints will likely be a weak spot and cause knocking.

colombian4u_61

iTrader: (3)

HELL NOOO!!!

essential1

iTrader: (5)

You nailed it on the head.

The only thing is I wish most of these companies actually put out their shock dynos. I remember a link I found a while back where some guy tested a bunch of major brands on his in-house shock dyno. And the only stand-alone damper available for the maxima that even scored decent were the KONI yellows if i'm not mistaken.

I personally think the dampers JICs and Tein coilovers come with are better/on par with most of the available stand alone dampers on the market for the maxima at the least.

Another thing you have to remember also is that most of the coilovers we are refering to were recently "improved". But that doesnt mean anything though because we still have no hard evidence to prove how much they've improved or if they even changed anything that the color scheme at all.

MoncefA33

iTrader: (6)

On a Maxima-specific application, a severe drop on springs/struts will hamper suspension travel regardless of bump stops (detail on "different" ones?).

We don't have much suspension travel initially, and with Eibach/similar springs it's bearable but if you want more than a 2" drop you'll sacrifice too much travel.

Look at what people say about the Tein S-techs, you're basically riding around on bump stops all the time (even when cut/modified). With coilovers specifically for the fifth gen Maxima, you don't lose suspension travel with height changes. (Fourth gen Tein Basics lose travel with decreased height but we're only talking about A33s here).

Grand_hustle17

iTrader: (22)

Teach em cef, as some ppl just like to sound educated.... I didn't get gow bump stops came in play as the height is reduced via the shocks

MoncefA33

iTrader: (6)

It's not even a problem with the bumpstops/springs/coilover/non-coilover/whatever mad tyte JDM fast and furious bright orange suspension 2slow is talking about.

It's a problem with the platform. Maximas have zero tolerance for reduction in travel to begin with.

2slow

iTrader: (6)

Suspension travel prior to touching the bump stop (which is what you seem to be speaking off) is the total travel minus the bump stop length; where a shorter bump stop provides greater 'free' travel. Is there something wrong with this logic?

Alternative bump stops are commonly available; though they won't hold up the dust boot, just like cut OE stops. Also, Koni dampers can be installed in a manner to increase travel.

Yes, and my implied point was sometimes people lower their cars excessively. But, again, shorter and more progressive spring rate bump stops can regain some travel.

Perhaps that is the wrong spring (excessive lowering) and bump stop (even when meticulously cut) choice.

On another note, how much travel does the front suspension have before the tire runs out of room, hits something (i.e. fender, fender while turning, etc...). I am curious where the actual travel limit is regardless of available travel.

I relish my lack of education, thanks for noticing.

Perhaps, but those things come with their own set of problems.

2slow

iTrader: (6)

Good comments, though I would disagree with quality of the Tein dampers (and surmise the JICs don't buck the JDM trend, and seem to suffer reliability issues). For example, here are shock dynos from a NB Miata which shows the superiority of aforementioned Konis:



The Konis have a good adjustment range below 3 in/s whereas the Teins offer limited adjustment range with little low speed damping (<3 in/s) and excessive high speed (>3 in/s) damping. These traits will give little control of driver induced motions with a harsh ride. At least the ride will get harsher and more 'sporty' as you crank up the **** :sarcasm:.

For reference I use Koni's with Eibach springs.

2slow

iTrader: (6)

To expand upon a point, the OE bump stops do not appear very progressive (spring rate), which would be exacerbated by cutting. Therefore, the transition in ride quality is likely abrupt and harsh fostering the opinion lowering springs = harsh ride. A more progressive rate (and shorter) bump stop would alleviate many of these complaints.

For reference, a myriad of bump stops are available from: http://www.resuspension.com/Bump-Sto...p-1-c-328.html (where I purchase bump stops). They are also available from Ground Control and Koni to name a some others.

Grand_hustle17

iTrader: (22)

i wasnt talking about you but moreso in general as if i was talking about you i doubt i'd be afraid to call you by name, this is something done all over this forum.... there was a saying back in the days, "who the cap fit, let them wear it"

MoncefA33

iTrader: (6)

Absolutely not.

So you listed:

Aftermarket bumpstops that are progressive rate/shorter, as well as Koni dampers.

IMO, the bumpstops are a band-aid fix to a fundamental problem with lack of travel.

And won't the Konis have a similar issue with running out of travel if the chosen spring is too low? Koni makes great dampers, but the bottom line here is that since you're not changing height independently of the damper's travel you will reach a limit.

I'd also like to point out the following.

http://www.koni-na.com/cat_search.cf...&submit=Search

So for A33, the front Konis are inserts.

Which means you have to cut the factory struts and slide the insert into the factory strut body.



"Excessive" lowering? Everyone in this thread is lowered to or past the point of where they would have any kind of bearable suspension travel on a regular spring setup.

essential1

iTrader: (5)

NICE! Thats what I like to see. Not surprised on how superior the Konis are.

Another great point. Our bump stops are for the most part, well, bump stops. As in abrupt/harsh stop as you pointed out. Which means that a spring such as the s-techs with a relatively forgiving spring rate is/can be comfortable in theory, paired with a proper shock of course. But this is blinded by the sudden crash of our bump stop. And now that I think of it, we are basically proving why a progressive spring (and a more progressive bumpstop wont hurt either as you pointed out) is so important to a comfortable setup.

But i basically just re-iterated what you just said so don't spend too much time trying to decipher my bad attempt at trying to explain whats in my head.

I think we have the same understanding on whats going on with this topic. Its just that we have different personal goals with what we want to achieve out of our suspension setups. Its not wrong either way. Just different applications require different tools to get the desired results. Let me stop before I write a book now. lol

A32 Konis are the same way. And you can mod the koni inserts to increase travel by the way. I personally wouldnt bother with it though because of the initial cost of the dampers, plus the labor and given our goals. It works though and is worth it for those that do run konis.

Mr. Brett

iTrader: (7)

So that I don't start a bidding war with any other org members, is anyone else watching this auction?

If not, I'm thinking I'm going to throw a bid in last minute and give these a shot. I don't see how you can go wrong with a one-year warranty. Especially considering they'll just be doing DD duty...

tdabboud

iTrader: (6)

^ Yeah I have been looking at them, but I think I might bid next time around, get a couple reviews first. so its all yours man

Cant_Get_Ryte

iTrader: (52)

2slow

iTrader: (6)

Exactly. Coilovers offer the convenience of a pre-packaged solution, albeit at a price, that a piece-meal system cannot. I find the maturity of your posts within this thread refreshing (not that your posts in other threads are not mature).

Yup, so with some additional work, more travel can be had with the Koni inserts than other off the shelf dampers.

For reference:
http://forums.maxima.org/advanced-su...perch-etc.html

Bumps stops are a fundamental part of a properly functioning suspension system. Although not as important as primary springs or dampers, if wrong the performance (comfort or road-handling) could be very poor. This is why high-end damper manufacturers (Koni, Penske, Ohlins, etc...) offer an assortment of bump stops.

Yes and no, see above.

Wow, I didn't know strut inserts were pure evil hand forged by Devil himself. BTW, this process is not that difficult: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qzNZCnUYtzo.

See my and essential1's posts about bump stops adding/increasing ride harshness. Also, and as essential1 noted, soft springs which offer large 'drops' (i.e Teins) exacerbate this issue, and are prime candidates for alternative (non-OE) bump stops.

Also, I would like to emphasize that I am not a Koni fanboi, they are the not the ultimate damper, but they serve a purpose in the marketplace as a quality damper at a slight premium to other marginal solutions (holy run-on sentence).

On edit: one last note, more progressive bump stops will decrease the initial impact (change in spring rate) when contacted. This alone would likely increase ride comfort for many with lowering springs.

Grand_hustle17

iTrader: (22)

man, maybe i need to think in extreme depth when i buy things, i just wanna be slammed, screw the recommended lowering height and all the blah blah for real, i can almost bet my life that the OP is definately not thinking about any of this and knowing the OP personally, im sure he doesnt care one bit either lol.... good info though... maybe im a tad too shallow but i was sold on coilovers just for how the look and they make you slammed with a better feel for my suspension, all the 100 way adjustible and pillow ball top, middle or bottom i could give two ish about, i could change how low i wanted to go vs buying another set of springs and that was good enough to make me take that switch from springs.... maybe i need to be looking at all these crazy graphs which makes no sense to me to be honest

2slow

iTrader: (6)

This is absolutely correct. Many desire the aforementioned convenience of coilovers (a pre-packaged solution) over the complexity of building one's own solution.

While I am by no means an expert, I am here to help if you have questions (and I'll try to let you know topics which my knowledge runs short).

Edit: I really shoud've phrased the above sentence that's what WE are here for rather than I.

Grand_hustle17

iTrader: (22)

........ in all honesty, from coming from the so called "bad" k-sports to JIC's there was a bit better ride comfort but its really up to the buyers as coilovers really is in two categories ones made to be a bit more stiff focusing on sportiness (all the ones under $999) and ones who sacrifice some of that for comfort (the ones over $1000) BC's, boss chen(not made anymore), tein basic, tein SS, JIC's are all focused on either a softer spring or shock, all the others is the same except for labeling...

tdabboud

iTrader: (6)

So I ordered these c8 coilovers and just received them in the mail today. When i first opened them up I was thoroughly surprised at how nice they were. they are painted a nice red color and seem to be put together extremely well, even came with camber plates. I got a chance to stick on the fronts so far and they ride SO nice, better than any spring/strut setup I have been on. These also came with damper adjust ability on all 4 corners which really makes it nice. I would most definitely recommend these to anyone looking for a good set of coilovers. But I do have one question about the rears. The coilovers came with everything that i needed to put them together, but do i need to use the stock rear strut mounts and anything else from the rear struts to assemble these? besides those it seems pretty straightforward







EDIT: Finally got them all on the car! so far they have been holding up extremely well and i really feel planted to the ground when driving. I am very pleased with this. Definitely the best mod I have done so far!
I know I need spacers ha...but wheels are tucked

00o30

iTrader: (2)

^ I believe you would have to use stock rear mounts.

HotshotVQ35

iTrader: (5)

yup, this is correct, you might just want to buy new mounts for the rear anyway, depending on the mileage and then you wont have to worry about using a spring compressor

nismopc

iTrader: (3)

I disagree. I cut my OEM bumpstops and was able to easily keep the dust boots in place.

FRONT OEM Bumpstop/dustboot


REAR OEM Bumpstop/dustboot


Stay in place perfectly. No issues...

2slow

iTrader: (6)

Ok...

T_Behr904

Bumpin' this thread to ask for a long-term test report... How they holding up???

00maxima-600rr

This coilovers go for $1200 now, how much did it cost back in 2010?