check engine light after cleaning throttle body
07-11-2005, 09:27 AM
#42
It must be some kind of a software bug in the ECM.
As traderfjp, myself and others we can get the RPMs to go down to normal settings after doing the idle air volume learning, so the mechanically nothing is broken, also it should mean that sensors are not fried either, otherwise the RPMs would never go down to normal until you change the broken part or broken sensor, and as elgrande2003se pointed out the dealership tried to replace the TB first with no luck...
The question is what triggers the "bug", is it just unplugging the TB, or moving the butterfly valve while it's unplugged, and why do they have to replace the ECM, could they not simply re-flash it?
As traderfjp, myself and others we can get the RPMs to go down to normal settings after doing the idle air volume learning, so the mechanically nothing is broken, also it should mean that sensors are not fried either, otherwise the RPMs would never go down to normal until you change the broken part or broken sensor, and as elgrande2003se pointed out the dealership tried to replace the TB first with no luck...
The question is what triggers the "bug", is it just unplugging the TB, or moving the butterfly valve while it's unplugged, and why do they have to replace the ECM, could they not simply re-flash it?
07-11-2005, 09:31 AM
#43
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 342
More strange stuff. My engine light has been out all day but the idle is still high. I used the idle procedure to get the idle down and it stayed down for 2 starts and now is back to 1k rpm but the light is off. Go figure.
07-11-2005, 10:09 AM
#44
i just can't seem to follow the logic:
IF TB is good and no air leaks
THEN replace ECM
but what caused ECM to go bad in the first place?
what's keeping replacement ECM from going bad and throwing the same P0507 code?
what harm could we possibly have done by cleaning the throttle body?
i highly doubt that it's the cleaner, i think it's the moving of the butterfly valve while disconnected threw something out of whack, and tripped the ECM, and now even though the throttle body is back to normal, the ECM is messed up...
What do you think?
Do we have a Nissan engineer on this forum by any chance, maybe they could shed some light on this matter? Thanks
IF TB is good and no air leaks
THEN replace ECM
but what caused ECM to go bad in the first place?
what's keeping replacement ECM from going bad and throwing the same P0507 code?
what harm could we possibly have done by cleaning the throttle body?
i highly doubt that it's the cleaner, i think it's the moving of the butterfly valve while disconnected threw something out of whack, and tripped the ECM, and now even though the throttle body is back to normal, the ECM is messed up...
What do you think?
Do we have a Nissan engineer on this forum by any chance, maybe they could shed some light on this matter? Thanks
07-13-2005, 06:46 AM
#45
Stupid ECM...(and stupid me for cleaning the throttle body)
Has anyone found a solution that doesn't require going to the dealer and replacing ECM?
It is not that the idling @ 900 RPMs drives me nuts but the thing that when you let off the throttle the RPMs don't drop right away.
had advice from a friend to lube the butterfly shaft with a drop of oil on each end, did that but with no luck...it doesn't seem like the butterfly valve is binding anyway.
the other day i went on a long drive 2 hours plus, and before it i reset the ecm and did idle air learning, so it drove fine, idled at 700, no check engine light...but the next time i started the car the idle is up to 900 rpms again, check engine light on again (code P0507), and when letting off the throttle the rpms don't drop right away...
Any suggestions on what i can do to fix this? (sorry don't have the money at the moment to go to the dealer and replace the ecm, it's no longer under warranty as it's got 85K on the odometer)
I still don't understand, if it's problem with ECM programing, why can't they simply re-flash it with the newer firmware?
Has anyone found a solution that doesn't require going to the dealer and replacing ECM?
It is not that the idling @ 900 RPMs drives me nuts but the thing that when you let off the throttle the RPMs don't drop right away.
had advice from a friend to lube the butterfly shaft with a drop of oil on each end, did that but with no luck...it doesn't seem like the butterfly valve is binding anyway.
the other day i went on a long drive 2 hours plus, and before it i reset the ecm and did idle air learning, so it drove fine, idled at 700, no check engine light...but the next time i started the car the idle is up to 900 rpms again, check engine light on again (code P0507), and when letting off the throttle the rpms don't drop right away...
Any suggestions on what i can do to fix this? (sorry don't have the money at the moment to go to the dealer and replace the ecm, it's no longer under warranty as it's got 85K on the odometer)
I still don't understand, if it's problem with ECM programing, why can't they simply re-flash it with the newer firmware?
07-13-2005, 07:38 AM
#46
Senior Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 442
Originally Posted by traderfjp
I can't believe that spraying intake cleaner in the TB would do damage. There has to be a fix for this and somone at Nissan must know why this happens. I'm afraind to bring my car into Nissan because the stealership has no heart and will charge you until you have to take out a second mortgage to pay the bill. Has anyone gotten the idle fixed and the light to stay off?
On my 60k maintenance I had the stealership clean the TB, they charged me $78 for it. BTW, at the end of the service the labor cost ended up being 585 big ones!!! How do they sleep at night!!! My tags or tires(Sumitomo) don't cost that much.
07-13-2005, 07:48 AM
#47
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 628
i had this problem.. did the idle reset procedure with the key turning and pedal thing ... the idel went down ....but after i turned off the car and back on ...it went back up to 900.
went to the dealer.. he reset it with the consult tool. it was taking a little while to do for some reason. even he made a comment that it was taking a while. but it worked.
idle reset to 667rpm . and car runs beutiful.
went to the dealer.. he reset it with the consult tool. it was taking a little while to do for some reason. even he made a comment that it was taking a while. but it worked.
idle reset to 667rpm . and car runs beutiful.
07-13-2005, 07:59 AM
#48
Member
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 161
Originally Posted by meccanoble
now THAT sucks....does this apply to 2k-2k1 models as well?
I've got a 2001 - happened to me too when I cleaned mine at 57,000 miles. Same symptoms - increased, irratic idle, check engine light, etc. I ended up buying another whole TB from a junkyard to the tune of $100. Once I installed it, the car ran like a champ. My only guess is that their is a coating on the TB valve that dissolves when you hit it with TB cleaner (no, I didn't use carb cleaner
), and that lets too much air by the valve when closed...
07-13-2005, 08:06 AM
#49
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Mar 2005
Posts: 342
Interesting: In one case a new TB solved the problem. Did the CEL go off immediately when you installed the TB? In another case the dealer was able to reset all parmaeters with a consult. Changing out the TB doesn't sound right. My CEL went off for a while but is now on again. My high idle has been constant since the cleaning. Ripppppppppppppppppp
07-13-2005, 08:54 AM
#50
Member
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 161
[QUOTE=traderfjp]Interesting: In one case a new TB solved the problem. Did the CEL go off immediately when you installed the TB? In another case the dealer was able to reset all parmaeters with a consult. Changing out the TB doesn't sound right. My CEL went off for a while but is now on again. My high idle has been constant since the cleaning. Ripppppppppppppppppp[/QUO
Nah, it took about 3 days for the CEL to go off, but the car started running great as soon as I installed it (right at 675 rpm, smooth as silk). I understand that the CEL light will go off automatically if the 'out of spec' condition doesn't reappear within so many cycles. I'm guessing the code cleared too - because the emissions inspection guys never said anything about it when I got it's annual checkup...or they just didn't care.
I know one thing - changing out the IACV (idle air control valve) won't do it - I tried that first. I had to change the whole TB.
If my theory about a coating on the TB valve is correct - there is one other thing you guys could try, but keep in mind I haven't tried it, so use at your own risk! This all goes off the premise that cleaning the TB valve allows too much air into the engine at idle -
You've probably noticed a set screw on the right hand side of the TB that prevents the TB from closing past a certain point - I believe it's their to keep the valve from sticking closed, and it gives a constant point of reference for the TPS (throttle position sensor). You could try marking the screw's position (so you can set it back if it doesn't work), then backing it off a little to allow the valve to close a little more. Then you'll have to adjust your TPS per your repair manual to suit and try it. The down side to this is I don't know if you'll detect WOT (wide open throttle) on your TPS a little too early. You should be able to see that when you're performing the adjustment / check with the multimeter before you run the car. Good luck!
Nah, it took about 3 days for the CEL to go off, but the car started running great as soon as I installed it (right at 675 rpm, smooth as silk). I understand that the CEL light will go off automatically if the 'out of spec' condition doesn't reappear within so many cycles. I'm guessing the code cleared too - because the emissions inspection guys never said anything about it when I got it's annual checkup...or they just didn't care.
I know one thing - changing out the IACV (idle air control valve) won't do it - I tried that first. I had to change the whole TB.
If my theory about a coating on the TB valve is correct - there is one other thing you guys could try, but keep in mind I haven't tried it, so use at your own risk! This all goes off the premise that cleaning the TB valve allows too much air into the engine at idle -
You've probably noticed a set screw on the right hand side of the TB that prevents the TB from closing past a certain point - I believe it's their to keep the valve from sticking closed, and it gives a constant point of reference for the TPS (throttle position sensor). You could try marking the screw's position (so you can set it back if it doesn't work), then backing it off a little to allow the valve to close a little more. Then you'll have to adjust your TPS per your repair manual to suit and try it. The down side to this is I don't know if you'll detect WOT (wide open throttle) on your TPS a little too early. You should be able to see that when you're performing the adjustment / check with the multimeter before you run the car. Good luck!
07-13-2005, 09:04 AM
#51
Member
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 161
Originally Posted by traderfjp
Interesting: In one case a new TB solved the problem. Did the CEL go off immediately when you installed the TB? In another case the dealer was able to reset all parmaeters with a consult. Changing out the TB doesn't sound right. My CEL went off for a while but is now on again. My high idle has been constant since the cleaning. Ripppppppppppppppppp
Oh - I see I could create some confusion - the TB for the 2002 up Maximas is all electronically controlled (drive by wire) - but mine's old school - all mechanical - and very likely it's a totally different beast than mine.
07-13-2005, 09:58 AM
#53
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 628
Originally Posted by abakalen
goldmaxNYC,
How much did they charge you to reset it with consult tool?
What dealer did you go to?
How much did they charge you to reset it with consult tool?
What dealer did you go to?
i went to Star Nissan in Flushing NY
THe service rep is really cool guy. he didnt charge me anything ... just came outside with his Consult tool and did it in 10 minutes. He also did my Timing Advance months earlier.
07-13-2005, 10:21 AM
#54
GoldmaxNYC,
is it the one on 164-24 Northern Blvd?
I might have to go to NY in a couple of weeks, so might stop by that place...might as well have the timing advance done at the same time...the dealerships around my area suck.
Anyone know any good places around Philly? or maybe NJ?
is it the one on 164-24 Northern Blvd?
I might have to go to NY in a couple of weeks, so might stop by that place...might as well have the timing advance done at the same time...the dealerships around my area suck.
Anyone know any good places around Philly? or maybe NJ?
07-13-2005, 10:39 AM
#55
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Posts: 628
Originally Posted by abakalen
GoldmaxNYC,
is it the one on 164-24 Northern Blvd?
I might have to go to NY in a couple of weeks, so might stop by that place...might as well have the timing advance done at the same time...the dealerships around my area suck.
Anyone know any good places around Philly? or maybe NJ?
is it the one on 164-24 Northern Blvd?
I might have to go to NY in a couple of weeks, so might stop by that place...might as well have the timing advance done at the same time...the dealerships around my area suck.
Anyone know any good places around Philly? or maybe NJ?
the service dept is located @
Star Nissan Parts and Service
171-20 Station Road
Flushing, NY 11358
Parts: 718-359-7454
Service: 718-359-7444
2 blocks off northern.
07-13-2005, 12:58 PM
#57
Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 29
SES light
I had also the same issues, light came on, high idle speed, poor gas mileage.
My code was P0505. I cleared it 3 times with a ODBCII, it comes back. I changed back to my stock air box and droped it off for warranty repair. The changed the IAC/AAC valve and I'm picking the car up tonight. I'll keep you posted.
Phil
My code was P0505. I cleared it 3 times with a ODBCII, it comes back. I changed back to my stock air box and droped it off for warranty repair. The changed the IAC/AAC valve and I'm picking the car up tonight. I'll keep you posted.
Phil
07-13-2005, 01:29 PM
#58
Philthepain,
Did it happen after you cleaned the throttle body?
Actually your car is 2000 so it's not drive by wire system, its quite different anyway...
P0505 - Idle Control System Malfunction
Did it happen after you cleaned the throttle body?
Actually your car is 2000 so it's not drive by wire system, its quite different anyway...
P0505 - Idle Control System Malfunction
07-19-2005, 06:46 AM
#59
Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 29
Originally Posted by abakalen
Philthepain,
Did it happen after you cleaned the throttle body?
Actually your car is 2000 so it's not drive by wire system, its quite different anyway...
Did it happen after you cleaned the throttle body?
Actually your car is 2000 so it's not drive by wire system, its quite different anyway...
The mecanics will have to inspect the car a second time to find what's wrong
all over again. PS : my max is a 2000.
Thanks
07-19-2005, 10:48 AM
#60
Member
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 161
Originally Posted by philthepain
Yep, The day right after if I recall. Got the replacement installed, 40KM after the light came back on ! Anyone could give me pointers on what could give me that code P0505 (else than the IAC/AAC valve) ...sensors to replace ?
The mecanics will have to inspect the car a second time to find what's wrong
all over again. PS : my max is a 2000.
Thanks
The mecanics will have to inspect the car a second time to find what's wrong
all over again. PS : my max is a 2000.
Thanks
07-19-2005, 09:12 PM
#61
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 201
It's fixed!!! I went to the dealership to get my driverside seat fixed, and free "101 point inspection". I have 57k, but luckily I got the extended warranty. He asked anything else was wrong and I told him my SES light was on (I didn't tell him it's b/c I removed and cleaned my TB), and my a/c wasn't cooling very well. An hour later they gave me a free rental and said it would be ready the next day. They ended up replacing my seat motor, and installing a new TB. $1,300 worth of work picked up by my extended warranty! Now my car's back to normal and not trying to run away from me anymore. Oh yeah, they also recomended about 20 other things that "NEED" to be "maintained" that aren't cavered by the warranty. I'll save a few pennies and go somewhere else for that.
07-20-2005, 11:41 AM
#62
Junior Member
Join Date: Dec 2003
Posts: 29
P0505
Called up the Dealership to ask what other piece could cause my P0505 code even after the IAC was exchanged. He recommended to run a "re-learn" program from a Nissan gadget. He said, once the AAC/IAC is changed they have to tell the ECU to re-calibrate or something. Job is 1/2 hour of laybour anyways....I'll try that before asking to swap the whole Trottle body.
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
vingodine
5th Generation Classifieds (2000-2003)
45
05-21-2016 12:46 PM
homewrecker
5th Generation Maxima (2000-2003)
13
08-24-2015 08:56 PM
maxinout93
5th Generation Maxima (2000-2003)
3
08-20-2015 02:17 AM