eyal8r

Went to a dealer tonight- met a VERY COOL saleswoman- got talking to her for a while. She let me in on a few things...

1) The other guys on the lot are making $4-5k PER DEAL COMMISSION! She says that she doesn't care about that- and is happy making $500. I know what you are thinking, but honestly, I completely believe her due to the nature of our conversation for that hour. She's not in it for the money, more or less- her husband passed away, and she needed something to do with her time- and has always wondered about what all dealerships pad the price with. It's a long story, but- I do believe her on this one. I just can't believe that on a new 2003 Maxima, there's about 4-5k in markup for the salesman's profit! Any Nissan Salesmen out there care to comment?

2) theft Deterrant (sp?)- theft protection. This is just an etched in set of numbers that coincides with the VIN on all the car's windows. An extra precaution so if the car is stolen, and VINs removed- they have to break out all the windows as well. The dealer sometimes 'throws this in' or charges $900 (at this dealership) extra for it- but, you can REFUSE IT, and guess what- they can't go back and take it off- IT COMES STANDARD and the dealer charges extra for it! She told me to refuse it and have the price reflected when I go to purchase...

3) Desert Paint Protection (I think that's what she called it- she had an accent)- guess what. Another $1200 THROW IN the dealer uses to markup the price and pad his pocketbook. The paint is under Manufacturer's warranty NO MATTER WHAT- and you don't need another $1200 for it...

Can you believe that? Soo- even if you take the commision down to $1000- you can still cut off a good $5-6k in the cost of a new car! that means I can get a NEW Maxima for the price of a used, or new Altima! Well- at least TRY TO anyways... I know there's crap like this thrown in on all cars from when I bought my truck. Does anyone else know of any little gotchas or secrets that the dealer's use to nail us on?

I was also told the 2004 Maxima's are out the first week of March- which means the 02/03's will be price dropped a few thousand on top of this stuff... Which means in a few weeks, I should be able to get a new, 03 for the current price of 02s... Does anyone think I'm far off on this stuff? Am I way off track, or is this right on? How much price drop do you think it will be?

Also- in reference to the secrets I stated above- am I way off track- do you think it's possible for me to drop all that extra crap off the price? Thanks a TON for all the input guys!!! I can't wait to get my Maxima- either new OR used...
D

2k2kev

yep, you're wayyy off track. You can look up the invoice price of a new car on any number of websites... are you saying they're still making $5k commission on that, and you can get them to take that price off? I highly doubt it. I paid less than $26k for my loaded (minus NAV) 2k2 6-speed and at that time there was no way I could have paid less. If you think you could have paid $21k for that same car at that same time, you should go into business for yourself buying from the widow and reselling cars (not trying to be a jerk, just trying to get some $$$ for you).

good luck

03BlkSETE

iTrader: (3)

She was pretty, wasn't she? Most of us here are buy the Max at close to or below invoice. Sales people are not making much on a sale like that. The only time the make 4-5k on a sale is with a hot product that's selling at or above sticker.

POPO6SPD

iTrader: (1)

Hi guys,

I've sold new/used Dodge cars for a part-time job a couple of years ago. On a new car you make anywhere from $75-150, and on a used car the skies the limit. It all depends how much your'e customer grinds you. Generally you get like 2% of the selling price I think, but don't quote me on it

wild willy

iTrader: (10)

I for one...would be a car salesman if your numbers were accurate...No way....she was tickle'n your *****

sorcereur

That is the salesman you should be the most afraid of. She got you right where she wants you; you'll be buying from her since you think the others are making a boat load, then she'll make the money everyone makes. Pretty smart of her. Gotta hand it to her.

JAKE02

hmmmmm let me think a minute....NO way they make 5K commision off one car.....man she had you hook, line and sinker....

soundmike

iTrader: (24)

I'll tell you this first hand, brand new car salesmen/women *do not* make $5k commission per car - unless we're talking about those in the mid-upper 6 digits.

#2 is a well-known fact, 99% of new vehicles come with VIN etching from the factory. Down here in Houston i have only seen one dealership touting it's something they just added - and thus demands a higher price. Other dealerships already know that customers are wise to them and don't bother with it.

#3 it's quite similar to "Undercoating". Most, if not all, new vehicles come with several layers of paint, rust protection and undercoat from the factory. Anything beyond that is either pure marketing hype or something else.

You'll be surprised of the "techniques" that a lot of dealerships teach their sales people during the training process.

92 SE-R 02 SE

Only way salesmen are making 4-5K on a car is if they sold it at sticker and no one buys a max at sticker! Like someone else said, i got my 02 loaded without Nav for 25.8K. sticker was 30.8K

TimW

iTrader: (6)

ha, even when there was a waiting list on the max, my salesperson made $150 on the sale. The dealer made ~$1K on the dealer holdback as I got the car for invoice (3.25% for Nissan dealers I believe).

The secret is car salespeople, any gender on any lot, will load you full as much crap was youre willing to swallow oh wait, thats not a secret..

jjs

Oh you know it!!! If they weren't trying to make a buck (or a bunch of them), they would be working at no-****er Saturn dealerships where (I assume) commissions are pretty static.

Maybe a bit of an exaggeration, but you get the theory...

olincoles

If I had to guess, she probably killed her husband for the insurance money. Just kidding...don't flame!

eyal8r

WOW! I guess I got sucked into it BIG TIME! Kinda makes me want to apply for a job just to go through the training and find out as much as possible before purchasing! Shoot- do employees get discounts? hehehe...

Soo- the invoice price is about as little as I can expect to get out of this? What about when the 04's come out in a couple weeks? Will they drop the price significantly BELOW invoice just to get rid of the overstock on the lot??? Afterall- who's gonna wanna buy an 02 or 03 when the 04 is out and just a little more price? I would think they would DEFINITELY be dropping price. Any thoughts on that?
I REALLY appreciate all the feedback guys!
D

nismotech

There is NO such thing is Nice Sales men. They are only nice to you in order to lead you to believe in whatever they tell you.

Not that they are bad person off their jobs, but their JOB is to make sales, who wouldn't want to make more money?!

asu174

iTrader: (11)

I am in sales. I never, ever rip anyone off. All of my clients get the best bang for the buck. Blanket statements like that are completely ignorant. That's like saying all black people like fried chicken and watermelon.

If you are referring to CAR salesmen, even then, you are wrong. You are obviously not dealing with the right salespeople if you feel that way.

2k2kev

they won't go much below invoice... they're not going to lose money on the cars. Nissan does give them incentives to move cars so they can wiggle below invoice and still make money, but don't count on getting one of those deals.

you can really find all this stuff out at any number of car buying websites...try reading some of these

dealer holdback

10 steps to buying a new car

confessions of a car salesman (this is both funny and sad)

kelley blue book suggestions

Quicksilver

iTrader: (1)

I like the way one of the local Atlanta dealerships does their commission. They give everyone a set dollar amount per vehicle sold, no matter if it's an SVT Mustang Cobra or a base model Focus (it's a Ford dealership, if you haven't figured it yet). $150 per car sold, plus their base salary. Not too shabby, in my opinion. They do tend to mark up some "premium" vehicles (not the Cobra, but the MACH 1) and some of the Rousch ones, but they are pretty straight shooters otherwise.

ms.thicknes

[begin postwhore] we do....but then so do white people and green people and yellow people and red people, and orange people and all the colors of the rainbow

I think I'll have some for lunch [end postwhore]

asu174

iTrader: (11)

To rephrase my racial slur........

Black people ONLY eat fried chicken and watermelon.

ChillWill2000

Sure its a blanket statement but 99% of people here on the org would agree that the good majority of salesman WILL take you for a ride if you let em. You might be honest, but thats what? probably 1 out of every hundred?

his statement wasnt that far off the mark.

soundmike

iTrader: (24)

I agree. It's just sad to see that because of what others do, the good people go down with them.

In any case, to answer the previous question. Most dealerships get the vehicles at anywhere between 3-5% below invoice. They also make money out of high volume sales and such.

vito1281

Agreed. Most of them will judge the customer when he/she steps into the showroom. I'm sure some of you guys/gals have seen people in the showrooms clueless about the models/options/prices/etc, and these are the types that dealers make the majority of their living on. However, if they see you coming in knowing your stuff, knowing what you want and how much you're willing to pay, they're less likely to try and take you for a ride.

In my experience, when I was shopping for the 2k3 Max, I told them straight up what I wanted (to the very last detail), and how much I was willing to pay. I was very insistent and confident, and most of them that couldn't float those prices didn't bother haggling with me, and just told me they couldn't do it. It's not in their best interest to waste time on a customer who knows his/her stuff, and isn't going to eat their BS.

So, do your research, and all the rest should work out on its own. If you find out what incentives dealers get (i.e. holdback, retro, quotas, etc), and mention it to them, they'll be dumbfounded that you know their tricks, and will either sell you the car for their bare minimum or will not. Just make sure you convey your knowledge of their "tricks".

Think about it, if you were a car salesman, and a knowledgeable and confident customer walked in, you'd be less likely to try and bull**** him. On the other hand, if you have the clueless type, you'd be more likely to squeeze every dollar out of them.

eyal8r

Basically, from all the researching Im reading- the most I can get is just a
few hundred under the invoice price. Is this true? Again, I ask how much you
think (if any) if will discount when the 04s come out in a week or two??? I
assume THEN I can get the few hundred invoice (the now best price) PLUS now
the new discount- so maybe even greater under invoice??? Anyone have
comments on this? The current invoice price Im getting from the 03 Maxima SE
w/ sunroof is right about 23-24k- so is it safe to assume that if I pay this
price, that I am getting a good deal? then, once the 04s come out- dont you think I could get an 02 for less than 20k? Or maybe an 03 for 21-22k? Maybe less???
Thanks
D

olincoles

I agree with asu174 in that all sales people aren't evil. They are slightly twisted though.

BLKMAX005SPD

iTrader: (1)

Where i live the local Benz dealer...makes and average of 7g's per car...when they sell it...thats crazy...thats why ppl should buy used...
We have a 2001 E55...brand new around 80 i believe...We got it for 60g's
with only 7,000 miles...how crazy is that
20 grand someone lost.
Owell his lost our gain...

NyMaxedOut

iTrader: (8)

hey, what do you do when you daughter brings home the gentleman and says: he's a car salesman!

TonyCooper

When I bought my 03, I simply went to several web sites, found the base invoice price, added the cost of the options I wanted (invoice price on them too), looked at the dealer holdback (2% of invoice price) and determined what dealer rebates that were offered ($1K). I then offered them invoice - rebate ($1K) - 1/2 of holdback. IOW, their profit was 1/2 of holdback. This got me into the ballpark range that I was willing to pay. (They have to make something on em...)

Once I got them to agree to that, I then talked trade in. I managed to get $2K trade in for my very used 91 Camry with 191K miles on it.

After this we talked financing... got the 2.9% financing from Nissan.

And watch for the "paper work fee" (usually about $300) crap that most all dealers try to pull. They won't want to talk about this until the financing stage... after the deal is sealed, they'll try to add this on.

NEVER EVER let them mix the 3 parts of the deal into one big number jumble or you'll lose.

I use this methodology whenever I purchase a car. I have no problem with someone making money on a deal, I just don't want them to take me to the cleaners.

Tony

RF951

Here's what I would do:

Do the research for the exact car you want. Lets say that invoice is $24k. If there is a rebate, figure that seperate. Go into the dealership ready to sign. Make them an offer for less than you would expect them to sell the car...say $22.5. Be prepared to counter their offer and get to say...$23k. If they say no walk out. Be polite and get up and leave. My point is that you have all the power. You have to set an amount you won't go over and if it doesn't happen leave. I have found that the BS ends when they know you are willing to leave.

My numbers are examples as I don't know what yours are.

00gxe5sp

iTrader: (1)

TonyCooper is right....always do each part seperately....

Also, know that they ALL LIE. Maybe they all don't, but you have to think this way, or you'll get burned like I just did. Look for my thread titled "xterra saga continues"

I thought I was getting damn good at this car buying thing...

nyc03gle

This is excellent advice.

trey

I do agree with the salesmen making more on maxima's then other cars cause when i was looking to buy an altima that salesman was soooo pushing the maxima over the altima. Once i drove the max, i wanted it!

karguy

I sold Nissans and the salesperson makes 25 to 30 percent of the profit. MSRP is usually 7 to 10 percent over dealer cost. There is a couple percent holdback but it is used to defray advertising. Dealers are charged for national sales campaigns and the holdback is used to pay for it. Minimum commission on Maxima is $100 and tops out at approximately 25 to 30 percent of profit. For a salesperson to make $5000 would require a profit of $25,000. That would mean someone is paying $50,000 for a Maxima!!! With car costs and MSRPs available on the internet people are paying closer and closer to dealer cost. The finish protection she referred to is called pack in the trade. It is a good not high quality finish protectant that the dealer pays $135 for and tries to sell for as much as possible. Question to ask when negotiating is "if I need this protectant, does that mean your clear point paint isn't any good?". This should slow down the flow of BS. Etching on glass takes about 5 minutes to do with template and acid. We charged $125 for it and it cost dealer about $25. She sounds like a new salesperson parroting what someone told her. Visit her in a few months and reality will have set in. Using her commission numbers lets do some math. If you are not selling 25 cars a month get a job at McDonalds flipping burgers you'll make more per hour. So you sell 25 cars at $5000 commission each you are making $125,000 a month times 12 months or $1,5000,000 a year! Do you really believe the sales people you've meet are making that kind of money. You'd have doctors, lawyers and rocket scientists trying to get car sales jobs. Colleges would have special
programs for car sales persons. She might have been sincere but sounds like a rookie sales person.

SG01MaxSE

Holy crap... ms.thiknes is black?!?


asu174, you're just not very good at this racism stuff.

eyal8r

THIS IS ALL GREAT STUFF!!!
THANKS FOR ALL THE HELP!!!
D