matty

iTrader: (54)

Alright got the correct MM today to read Amperage. On the 10A setting, I am getting .10 with the hood closed. Pulling fuses inside, I cant get it to go any lower.

I unbolted the alternator, no change, unplugged the starter, no change, unplugged all of the fluses in the engine bay and under the dash, no change.

Now there has been NO bulb in the trunk forever. I did unplug the actual switch and there was no change to the .12. Could that switch be drawing current if its dead.

I read that .25 to .50 is an acceptable amount of drain.

So my car tech. passed the test, so its gotta be the battery unable to hold a charge ??

-matt

max80228

I definatley feel your pain as I have check all of this on my car. I love my maxima but I am ready to drive it off a cliff... Anyways its not the battery as I have been through 5+ in the past two years since I have had a charging issue that no one can find. Car ran perfect before the alternator went out two years ago. Now I never know if its going to start. i just know if I dont drive it everyday its dead the next. Come on gurus help us out. I like the think we arent the only two out there that have had this problem???

Nopike

iTrader: (2)

Assumming both your battery and alternator are fine, and you can get those tested relatively easily. I would focus on the connections common to the battery and alternator.
1) Make sure the connections from the negative terminal of the battery to ground are secure and clean. Not sure what that ground wire connects to (trans, or frame) but needs to be checked.
2) Make sure the ground connection of the alternator has a good clean/secure ground. This is the black wire running from alternator.
3) There is a thick black with red stripe wire that runs from the alternator to the underhood fusebox to fusible link "a" (which is 120 or 150Amps) from there it runs to the positive terminal of the battery. I would make sure these connections and the fusible link are all clean and secure because if they are not your charging circuit may not be fully recharging your battery as you drive.

A parasitic drain is also a possibility, but the above mentioned charging circuit is realtively simple and can be easily checked.

matty

iTrader: (54)

bump

matty

iTrader: (54)

anyone ?? Is .10 draw too much ?? should I look further or replace the battary again ??

Nopike

iTrader: (2)

. If your battery is like 5 years old you have nothing to lose by changing it. If it is relatively new something else is probably the cause of your problem and changing it will not help. I mean if it is relatively new it is possble you got a defective battery but the chances of that happening are pretty slim.

I'm not sure what the "sleep" current should be but it sounds like you did a good job of disconnecting all the circuits by removing the fuses and the current draw did not change so more than likely the current draw you see is normal. I would suspect that your charging system is not working properly and your battery is not being recharged, but you really did not include much information about the problem and what you have done to try and resolve it. If you include more information others may be able to give you some advise.

matty

iTrader: (54)

Heres the rundown.

I have been having this problem for about a year now. Seems like if I drive the car, on a regular basis, theres no problem. If I let the car sit over the weekend, its dies. This is the third or forth Optima Redtop battery.

I finally got a working MM to measure amps and Im getting a .10 amp draw with the hoods switch unplugged. I unhooked the alternator, starter and all of the fuses inside the cabin, with no change to the .10 draw. I have alot of gauges and things run off my cig lighter but with that fuse removed, there is no change either.

Im thinking now that the battery is completly shot. I charged the battery yesterday, went to start the car today at 1, and completly dead. If I battery pack it, it starts.

My main question is, on a 10A setting, I am getting .10. Is that high, low, perfect ??

Whats the next step here ?

Nopike

iTrader: (2)

According to the website below, 25 to 50 milliamps is normal. That is equal to .025 or .050 amps. It looks like you Max is drawing 100 milliamps which is equal to .10 amps. So sounds like yours may be on the high side. I'll try to test my Maxima tomorrow (hate losing my presets, but maybe if I work fast). If the current draw is excessive the next step would be to disconnect any aftermarket electronics and check the draw.

I searched the org but could not find any values for the Maxima, I know the information is out there.


http://www.wikihow.com/Find-a-Parasitic-Battery-Drain

matty

iTrader: (54)

Yea, I saw that website. I posted up here to see what everyone else is getting.

The only thing I really have is the Emanage Ultimate. I did the wiring, and did it very maticulous. I took out the cig lighter fuse, since I have everything wired to that, and nothing changed as far as the draw.

-matt

JSMax

iTrader: (13)

I had an excessive amount of draw. Same kind of story. I took the car into nissan and they ran a diagnostic on the factory security system. Turned out that the trunk switch was busted and it was preventing the factory alarm from going into sleep mode.

I only post this information as there is no way I would have been able to find that problem on my own. Maybe something you could look at?

Good luck with your draw... I know how frustrating it can become.

matty

iTrader: (54)

The trunk switch for the light, correct ? Thats hooked into the security system ?

Is it the cylinder switch ($51) or the actual switch on the lock mech for the light ($9) ??

thanks
matt

gallilaw

My car drains a brand-new or otherwise charged battery while driving.

I thought I had a parasitic drain problem, found a sticky trunk release switch, fixed it, and metered my turned-off current to only 3 ma.

But the car still drained a brand-new Optima from 12.6 volts to 8+ volts and left me stranded.

When the car is running the alternator tests at 14 volts (measured at the battery terminals). I still suspect the alternator, possibly because that would be easy to fix, but also because it's hard to see why there would be such a drastic drain on the battery if the alternator were functioning when the car is turned on.

Help would be appreciated.

JSMax

iTrader: (13)

For me it was the cylinder switch. Don't go throwing money at parts if your not 100% sure that's the problem.
I don't believe that the trunk light is hooked into the security system. When I would close the trunk, the light would go out. I checked that to see if the light was staying on.... but no. It was the factory security system thinking that the trunk was still open and that's what was my problem.
hope that helps.
for nissan to hook up their diagnostic machine (in Canada) it was $90. I was told what the problem was, and the dealership asked if I wanted them to proceed or if i was going to fix it myself. Best $90 I spent after I blew through about $80 in tylenol trying to find the problem.

matty

iTrader: (54)

Well after looking a bit further, and getting a few faxes from David Burnette on the scematic of switches, I went out and investigated a bit further in the trunk, and BINGO !! Well there is NO switch near the key cylinder for the alarm system in my car. There is also an empty plug hanging there for the switch.

The thing is, I have only had a 2nd vehicle for about 2 years now, so with having the car sit for a day or two is when the problem occurs. If I use it daily, then theres no problem at all. David Burnette ran the VIN and found that I should have the switch on my model.

I ordered the swith from Nissan, $47, and that should fix the problem, lets hope. Thinking back, even when I had my car sitting over the weekend, it would need a jump. Wierd stuff. Not sure where that went but it had to be from the previous owner.

-matt

max80228

Let me know if that fixes the problem. I dont think its my problem however. Ive had mine since 2001 and it only started when my alternator went out 2 1/2 years ago- very mystifying indeed. I am beyond annoyed!!

MorpheusZero

iTrader: (10)

I've got a parasitic drain problem too, and being an electrical engineer there are a few things I'd like to add to this thread:

1. The battery does NOT influence current draw. If you have too much draw (.1 amps or 100 milliamps is too much) it is NOT because of the battery, and replacing the battery will NOT solve the parasitic drain problem, although it may increase the amount of time your car can sit before the battery will be drained because the battery will hold more charge to begin with.

2. I have a similar problem (about 100 milliamps drain) although I've noticed that when I pull the power window fuse it will reduce by about 30 milliamps to 70 or so milliamps. How much current does the alarm system draw in this scenario?

matty

iTrader: (54)

I am exaclty at 100 milliamps, nothing less from anything being pulled. Should be right around 50 to 25 in full sleep mode. If I used the car every day, its fine, one or days of sitting, no good.

If im completly missing that switch for the alarm system, the alarm never goes into sleep mode because its an open end connection. Nothing is plugged in there. I really cant see it being anything else at this point.

-matt

Nopike

iTrader: (2)

I checked my 98 SE which works normally and does not have this problem. I opened my hood and checked current with everything else off and closed. The draw was approximately 0.1 Amps = to 100 milliamps. This is the same as Matt's result. If I depress the switch that senses if the hood is closed after about 30-60 seconds the current draw goes down to about 0.01 Amps or 10 milliamps. This must be the sleep mode kicking in. That is quite a a difference. I can understand if another switch from the alarm system is malfunctioning, of missing, the car would never go into sleep mode.

I'm not certain if the 0.1 Amps is enough to drain the battery over the period of 1-2 days but you certainly should fix it to work properly as noted above so that it does go into the sleep mode.

matty

iTrader: (54)

Its gotta be enough to drain the battery, because its happening to my setup. New battery and new Alternator.

Good to know, thanks for doing that for me man, I appreciate it.

One of my door switches is also broken, at $14, so Im gonna change that first and see if it changes.

-matt

Nopike

iTrader: (2)

The trunk key cylinder switch connector has a brown with yellow stripe wire and a green with yellow stripe wire running to it.

Only one problem, the trunk, hood and trunk cylinder switches are all open until the trunk or hood is opened. When you open the hood or trunk the switch makes or closes. This would mean if a switch is missing the BCM will think that the trunk or hood is always closed. Hopefully replacing the switch will fix your problem, but if I am right about this it may not. Regardless you are on the right track.

Nopike

iTrader: (2)

Door switch is also a possibility, those work in the same manner as the hood and trunk switches. If you want to test, disconnect the red/white or black wires running to the switch. This will be the same condition as having the door closed. I know it sounds strange but these switches only close when a door is open, if the door is closed they are open.

matty

iTrader: (54)

Now Im totally confused....

Wouldnt it be, if its completly missing, it would act like it was broken ?

Nopike

iTrader: (2)

Sorry, unless you work with relays and switches it can be confusing, sometimes I get confused.

How can I explain this, the switch only functions when the door is open If the door is closed it's the same as if there were no switch there.

I may have it backwards, but don't think so, regardless you are still on the right track. You need to make sure the car gets in the sleep mode.

Nopike

iTrader: (2)

Just try changing the door switch first, you may not need a trunk switch.

danny60632

Sounds like you are correct sir!

A couples of months ago my new battery was constantly draining as well. It was annoying as ****. Luckily i found that the switch to the hood was tucked away by the battery. Meaning the Alarm never went to sleep mode. I unpluged the switch and the problem has gone away.

JSMax

iTrader: (13)

Matty.... my trunk switch was unplugged. I had some body work done on the rear end of the car and those clowns must not have plugged it back in. After nissan told me what the problem was I simply plugged this switch back in and the current dropped down to like .1 or something really low. I don't remember exactly what the voltage reading was.
I believe in my case that the alarm was trying to see if everything was ok to go into sleep mode and it was getting a message back saying that the trunk was open and therefore the alarm would not go into sleep mode. The car saw the trunk as open. That would mean that the switch should be closed.

Funny how something so small can cause such a headache. Glad I could help you out.

matty

iTrader: (54)

Well I have NO sensor there, and just a plug hanging there. So you think thats the problem ??

I have One sensor in the trunk and its on the center latch thats clicks into the body of the car. Its a tiny sensor on that latch that controls the light when the trunk opens but there are bars that go across the trunk that hit that sensor when you turn the key. You think that has anything to do with the security, or only the light ?

-matt

eng92

iTrader: (3)

What is your definition of a charged battery?
Here is a handy reference
http://www.autobatteries.com/basics/voltage1.asp

What is the construction of your battery? Different constructions require a certain minimum charging voltage.
http://www.landiss.com/battery.htm


IMO 14.0V is too low to keep an Optima battery charged.

Have you monitored what the charging voltage is while driving? I imagine your 14.0 V measurement with the engine running was taken without any other loads on the system. The use of headlights, stereo, blower motor etc while driving will pull that 14.0V down. If it drops below the terminal voltage of your battery, it will begin to discharge.

eng92

iTrader: (3)

There is a normally closed (N/C) switch for the trunk lid that connects to the BCM. This switch serves both security system and trunk room light functions. It is N/C so it provides a ground to BCM pin 37 when the trunk is open. Obviously if it is unplugged, no ground is provided, and it is the same as if the trunk is closed.

There is also a switch on the trunk lock cylinder to detect both tampering and if a key is inserted and turned more than a certain amount. These are both normally open contacts. If the connector is disconnected, it will again behave as if everything is normal

matty

iTrader: (54)

So now I am definetly lost on what to do.

The switch thats on trunk lid connector for the light does NOT work and the cylinder switch is completly missing.

JSMax

iTrader: (13)

I would take it in to nissan and have them diagnose this condition. Their consult will be able to tell them/you in about 15 minutes. At least you wouldn't be throwing $$$ into parts you might or might not need.
Think of it as a peice of mind.

Good luck.

matty

iTrader: (54)

They will just blame all my aftermarket wireing I have in the car.

Not worth the hassel and the waste of $105.

eng92

iTrader: (3)

Our older cars are not instrumented well enough to diagnose electrical problems online.

The Consult on a 4th gen won't tell you anything more than you can do yourself with a decent volt meter and some electrical lnow-how.

eng92

iTrader: (3)

Unfortunate, but probably true.


I did not see any mention of your battery or charging system parameters.
(eg. battery no load voltage, alternator charging voltage (both no load and loaded)

It is also useful to monitor the voltage and current while the battery is charging (external chargera) as their rates can give insight into the "health" of the battery.

matty

iTrader: (54)

http://www.alibaba.com/product-gs/20...ETER_830D.html



I have that unit, how to check the battery parameters ??

matty

iTrader: (54)

I still have a Parasitic Draw though

-matt

Nopike

iTrader: (2)

I would suggest you forget about the trunk switch for the time being, remove the broken door switch and disconnect the wiring from the switch. You can leave the door open because with the switch removed it will think that the door is closed. Open your hood and connect your ammeter as before. Depress the hood switch and see if your curret draw goes from approx. 0.1 Amps to 0.01 Amps in 30-60 sec. If this occurs replace the door switch and you should be in business. If not you will need to find out why the car does not go into sleep mode, probably a faulty security switch should not be that hard to find.

eng92

iTrader: (3)

I wouldn't call 100mA that excessive. Over a 3-day weekend (72 hours) that is only 7.2 AH.

I don't know of any car battery that would have less than several hundred AH capacity. With such a low drain rate, the AH rating of a typical battery would be even higher (>400). Obviously this is also very temperature dependent, but this is not an issue at this time of year.

eng92

iTrader: (3)

Let's put a 100mA drain into perspective

100mA at 12V is 1.2 W of power.

IIRC the stock headlights on low beam are 45W each. (90W total)

A 100mA parasitic drain for 72 hours is roughly the electrical equivalent of leaving your low beam headlights on for about an hour.

If my car wouldn't start after leaving the lights on for an hour (in the summer) I would be taking a hard look at my battery and charging system.

Nopike

iTrader: (2)

I agree that 100ma drain may not be excessive and may not be the cause of his problems but considering Matts situation and history with this problem it may be worth trying to make sure it goes into sleep mode and draws only about 10ma. It appears that he has changed batteries and alternators but maybe there is still an issue with his charging system. A competent shop should be able to check that fairly easily. I would consider taking it to Sears and have them check out the battery and charging system.