Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

If your transmission is making a strange "reciprocating" noise when your foot is off the clutch it is the INPUT shaft bearing. It is NOT your throwout bearing.

Your input shaft bearing spins when your foot is off the clutch, the input shaft gets "input" from the motor (meaning the motor makes it spin) when your foot is off the clutch. When you press the clutch pedal, the input shaft stops spinning, that's why the noise goes away.

The throwout bearing DOES NOT SPIN when your foot is off the clutch. It sits there doing nothing - bearings that aren't spinning can't make noise. When you press the clutch pedal, THAT is when your throwout bearing starts spinning. If your throwout bearing was somehow bad, it would make noise when your foot was ON the clutch.

matty

iTrader: (54)

So the trans is actually spinning when your idleing ?? I dont understand because the trans. shaft only goes so far towards the motor. It doesnt contact the motor.

Im in no way argueing, I just would like a better explination of this.

-matt

wunfstmax

iTrader: (7)

Your input shaft is spinning when ever the motor is running. The gears are just free to spin until the car is put in gear. Your input is meshed with a counter gear, the counter gear is attached to the counter shaft and goes to another gear on the counter shaft, which is meshed to another gear on the input shaft, this gear has the hub that is needed to syncronize the gear and lets the car move. So if the car is out of gear and your hearing a noise and think its transmission related, its either your input or pilot bearing.

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

The flywheel is attached to the engine obviously and will be spinning whenever your engine is running, regardless of clutch position. The clutch disk goes on the input shaft of course. When your foot is OFF the clutch pedal, the clutch disk is pressed against the flywheel, meaning they turn as one, spinning the input shaft. When you press your clutch pedal the clutch disk no longer makes contact with the flywheel and it stops spinning, even though the flywheel is still spinning .

Fr33way™

iTrader: (23)

I have this . No play in the axles however.

What made you come to this conclusion BTW?

SpeedCrazie

iTrader: (81)

Also is this a cheap / easy fix? Or would it be better to find another transmission?

siballiance

iTrader: (3)

I have this thing. when my car is cold not warmed up, its making this noise. I just changed my clutch. i dont know what is it, either its belt, or tranny, but i think its a belt, cause when i tied up it does away, and belt still making noise. machenic told me ( you could damage your pulley if you tied soo much) i dont know. but im ok with it.

is it true?

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

It has nothing to do with your axles. Play in the axles is indicative of a differential bearing problem. They are totally unrelated problems, unfortunately both are common in maxima transmissions.

I've known this for years, ever since I had my input shaft bearing replaced back in 2001 and bothered to discover how the transmission and clutch works. I just finally got fed up enough at these people who think they know what they're talking about telling other members that their throwout bearing is bad, when that is not true. They are giving out bad information simply because they don't know how the transmission and clutch system works.

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

It's not cheap. Back before I could do it myself I paid $600 to have mine fixed in 2001, and that is on the cheaper side of things. I've read of people paying over $1000 to have it fixed.

It's easy if you have the proper tools - but usually only transmission shops have the proper tools. You have to partially disassemble the transmission.

dgeesaman

iTrader: (10)

Neal's right on. I'm glad he posted this, as it seems to be a recurring theme.

When your foot is off the clutch, in all gears and neutral, the input shaft moves with the engine. In fact, it also spins the 1st and 2nd gears on the mainshaft too.

The throwout bearing is only active (aka capable of producing noise) when the clutch pedal is down. If you have input shaft bearing noise, it should away within a few seconds of putting the clutch in. The sound will die out as the input shaft coasts to a stop.

It's possible to DIY fix this, but you have to disassemble the tranmission (requires hand tools only) and either bearing pullers or a shop press to remove/install the new bearings. If the tranny died a premature death (less than 100k miles under normal usage) you'll also need some measuring tools to properly re-shim the shafts.

Dave

Fr33way™

iTrader: (23)

I was thinking of the diffy problem, thanks. I didn't have a full understanding of what was spinning when but I think I have a much better idea of that now.

So I must (or most likely) have the imput shaft bearing problem. Does this mean I have the metal shavings in the mix thus accelerating the problem? I was planning on shortening my tranny fluid change intervals. The transmission shifts very well 98% of the time so what problems could I expect as the imput shaft bearing gets worse?

I have the sound in my garage at idle clutch goes in, car gets quiet. I also have the whine but it is really only in 1st gear, has not changed since I bought the car (16-17K ago). I have driven 4th gens that whined in every gear so it hadn't concearned me all that much.

The good thing is I have always planned for it, I am just interested in being able to identify the progression of the problem.

Thanks for any help.

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

As the bearing wears out, the input shaft can start to have play in it. The more worn out, the more play there can be. Play is bad - it can make it so the gear teeth don't mesh evenly, causing abnormal gear tooth wear. This can cause whining noises and even lead to gear breakage because the gears can start to have loads exerted on them at weird angles. As play develops the input shaft seal will also eventually fail, meaning your trans fluid is going to start leaking out of your transmission through the bellhousing. Worst case scenario you could potentially ruin ever gear in the transmission, possibly the sleeves and hubs too, which could really wear out the shift fork contact points as well. You'd probably have to let the problem go for a stupid amount of time to do that much damage though.

Now you'd likely have to let the problem go for a long long time to do that sort of damage, but I've seen it on occasion. I don't recall how long I let the problem go in my first maxima before having it fixed, I think I first noticed noise in early summer and I got it fixed in early september. I didn't develop any leakage from the input shaft seal that I was aware of, and I didn't replace anything but the bearing itself. After the bearing was replaced there were no more abnormal noises which means there was probably no significant wear of the gear teeth. On another of my transmissions (the first one I had in my turbo car when I bought it) the noise was very loud, still no leakage though. No gear whine that I could detect HOWEVER the car had no exhaust on it at the time so it was very very loud, possibly masking any gear whine. When I tore that transmission down there was some slight wear on the gear teeth, borderline on whether I'd replace them or not. I got a good deal on a few other transmissions though so I haven't bothered to put that particular trans back together.

My friend let his go for about 6 months or so and I'm convinced he did damage to first gear, after he got it fixed his first gear still whined quite noticeably.

If you've got the problem and the money, there is no reason to let it go. It won't get any better, it'll only get worse, and potentially cost you much more to fix (I had a price list from Dave B of all the gears and shafts at one point, and trust me replacing every gear in the transmission is not something you'd want to do).

matty

iTrader: (54)

I took my old TO bearing out and its spins really well and is loud. My NEW TO bearing that came with my Clutchnet Clutch kit doesnt spin at all when you spin it..?? Is that normal ?? Do I get a Nissan TO bearing do you think ??

-matt

Fr33way™

iTrader: (23)

Thanks for the response. I will be looking into a couple different options. Since school is about to start again for me the money is going to get spread out once again. I may just baby it for this year and open it up/ replace it next summer.

dgeesaman

iTrader: (10)

Loose, fast spinning indicates a bearing that has a bunch of internal clearance due to advanced wear. Although they may have lower friction, they will (continue to) wear very rapidly and not support the shaft properly. As well, for sealed bearings like a t/o bearing, it can indicate the bearing seals are shot and it's out of internal lubrication.

A new sealed bearing will not spin around very freely, but if you press hard on it with the heel of your hand while turning it, you'll notice there is a glassy smoothness to it and no increase in friction. A worn bearing will feel rough when you turn it under load.

Dave

Poowill

iTrader: (12)

So since mine has been doing this ever since i got the car...i'm basically fawked. I have first gear whine, but i thought that was normal. So unless i spend tons of money to get my input shaft fixed this is just going to progess into a bigger problem? This sucks...my TO Bearing just failed and i'm having to replace my whole clutch. Now i read this and find out that i'll have another problem down the road with the tranny even after a full clutch rebuild...FTL! God i'm sick of dealing with tranny related problems.... :

Apparition

iTrader: (5)

hmm sticky material there Neal?.. Glad you posted this, time to take a look...

JSutter

iTrader: (46)

My original tranny had both differental and input shaft bearing noises. I never noticed the input shaft bearings until one morning I was at the drive through. I could hear it like crazy reflecting off the building. Then after I replaced the clutch the diffy bearings started to make noise, of course they got louder and louder. I got a leak at the drivers axle seal, which lasted until I replaced the tranny this year with an AE LSD. My original differential has about 1/8" of play which caused the leak. My new tranny is silent, thank god.

95maxrider

iTrader: (32)

Bump for a very informative thread. This is sticky material, but alas, stickies are basically dead.

My input shaft bearing is also making this noise, and after reading this I figure I might as well get it fixed now before I get left on the side of the road again (not fun). Now if only AE trannies were easier to come by....

Poowill

iTrader: (12)

Glad this post popped up again. Looks like my input shaft outer seal is leaking tranny fluid. I do get major input shaft noise when foot off the clutch, but there isn't much play. What's the best approach to take? See what happens when the seal is replaced?

dgeesaman

iTrader: (10)

Your input shaft does not have an outer seal; only the seal on the bellhousing side.

The differential carrier has two seals, and aside from the seal for the shifter striking rod, there are no others.

Dave

Poowill

iTrader: (12)

Yes that's it, just couldn't remember exactly what he called it. Its got a pretty good leak now...

dgeesaman

iTrader: (10)

You can do that, although my money is on worn input and diff bearings. I think you have a rebuild in your future - if you get it done properly and immediately, the bill should be reasonable. If you wait until it's drizzling oil, you'll probably run your tranny too low on oil and have waited until the ground up bearing grit wears out the gears and other bearings. Replacing the seal when you already have bearing noise and *any* play in the diff is basically a waste of labor.

Dave

BobK

I've never worked on a tranny but after getting some quotes from local transmission shops, I'm getting ready to tear into mine to replace the bearings. How hard is it to put in new synchros while I'm in there?

I picked up my bearing kit last week and found that the place I ordered from does rebuilds as well as sell parts. I asked the owner if I found that the synchros looked worn if I could bring the shafts in and have him pull the gears and replace the synchros. I said I thought I would be able to pull the diff bearings but I don't have a gear puller that would be able to reach the gears and I don't think I could find drifts to press the gears back on the shafts. He looks at me like I'm lost (which I am) and tells me you don't have to pull or press the gears on this transmission... I have no reason to doubt what he says so I say OK and wonder where I ever got that idea that the gears need to be pressed. After I leave I look at the FSM talks about pressing the gears off and back on is this really not necessary? If not it would make the job much easier than I had thought.

dgeesaman

iTrader: (10)

You will need to use a press to move the gears on/off the splines. That guy has never worked with this particular tranny.

Doing synchros about doubles the time required inside the tranny. Unless you *had* shifting problems, I'd leave them alone.

Dave

lophix

iTrader: (3)

Now the key question: is there a write up for this somewhere / tool & part list?

Edit: Thinking about it now, I have a spare 3rd gen tranny in the garage..I could tear into it to see what it would take to replace the I.S. bearing. Chances are they would be really similar.

BobK

I haven't had much trouble shifting until the last couple of days I drove the car. It's getting tough to shift into third, I'm hoping that it's not a synchro but trying to get all of the information I can find before disassembling this thing.

Expanding on what he said... if you remove ??? (can't remember exactly what) and hit the end of the shaft on a board the gears will slide right down the shaft, but you have to be careful because if they don't stay together you could bend or lose the springs, and if you do this you need to buy the baulk ring assembly with new springs ($$) because Nissan does not sell just the springs and you can't get them aftermarket because they are not the same kind of springs as most transmissions. He even drew a picture of the springs and it looked just like the springs in the bottom picture on page MT19 of the FSM. As a side note I found a write up on rebuilding Mitsubishi 5spd (RWD) transmission and in the write up they used a similar method (hitting the shaft on a board) to cause the gear assembly to slide off of the shaft. Just wondering if others had tried this method.

When I get it apart I may go ahead and take the shafts into him and have him check them out and if they need rebuilt I’ll see if he’ll let me watch the process.

KINGMAX

is there a possibility that we could get a diagram of all this? My haynes manual is stored away at my grandmother's house with the rest of my crap and I haven't had a chance to get it. The reason I ask this is because I am leaking fluid from where my passenger side half shaft enters the transmission, I haven't noticed any noises except a little squeeking when the car is rolling in neutral and it is more pronounced and happening when the car is in gear after long highway trips. Is any of this related? I planned on replacing my half axles in the next few months anyways because I have a freshly torn passenger side CV boot as well.

BobK

Haynes manual doesn't show any of the transmission internals for that matter either does the Chiltons manual, there is a sticky in the I30 forum that has some scans from the FSM (Factory Service Manual).

KINGMAX

thanks man, didn't know that was there. I see what is being talked about here now. I am also elated to know that I don't have to take the freaking transmission apart to replace that seal!!!

dgeesaman

iTrader: (10)

I'll be impressed if he does it that way. On this particular transmission the splines really have a good hold on the clutch hubs.

Once mounted in a press it all comes apart very smoothly and controllably.

I'm not big on replacing synchros because I've seen an overwhelming majority of problems coming from bearings. Plus, where I see some synchro wear I also see damage to the dog teeth on the clutch sleeve and gear. So replacing the synchros alone won't do much.

Dave

KRRZ350

iTrader: (29)

Yes, +1 to the fact that there is that sticky in the i30 forum, thanks to i30ds! As for the bearings, use a dremel with good reinforced cutting wheels, shim it up,, and put it back togethor.

Between motorvate's site and the manual u should be good. Forget the syncros btw. I mean, your car doesn't pop out of gear or grind going in im sure. I can handle my liquer.

sergofast

iTrader: (22)

Mine was making a slight wine from the input shaft, and then I installed a B&M short shifter on it and it got real loud. It had the same loudness on the stock shifter if you pressed it from side to side when you were in gear. Why would the short shifter do this? I know its the input shaft bearing, but dont know why the shifter would make it louder.

dgeesaman

iTrader: (10)

The short shifter has harder bushings and transmits more noise.

BobK

Speaking of the shifter, does anybody know the shifter bushing part numbers? I might as well change them as well while I'm in there.

Also I'm getting a "neutral switch" ECM code (don't remeber exact code) does anybody know the part number for the "neutral switch"When searching I found a "Backup switch" and a "Nuetral switch" for the 5spd but from the diagrams I only see one switch in the transmission.

KRRZ350

iTrader: (29)

The one switch performs both functions. Be prepared for all of your oil to gush out in 5 seconds when you remove it.

sergofast

iTrader: (22)

is this the part number for the input shaft bearing 32203-03E00 and 32203-03E10? Thats what I found at the dealership today. He said that either number would work, its the same part.

dgeesaman

iTrader: (10)

Yeah, that's the clutch side input shaft bearing. But really you should replace all the bearings in the tranny. To not bother on account of a hundred bucks is really bad economics.

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

I've seen upwards of 4 tons of pressure required to get the gears off on the shafts in the few maxima transmissions that I've taken the shafts apart in and that's pretty normal as far as pressing shafts apart goes so I wouldn't expect significantly less, 2-3 tons is pretty typical. If you can get them apart by banging them then that's great, but personally I wouldn't go banging around on them though. Too easy to hit it wrong, drop it on the floor, chip gear teeth, etc. Then you have to worry about banging them back together, etc.

Poowill

iTrader: (12)

I just got the outer seal replaced, it fixed the leak. But While he was replacing my mechanic saw that the outer bearing had some play in it, but said that the bearing looked fine and spun normally. Could there be a defect in the housing to cause play? Or would the input bearing cause this?