Stock MIDpipe Vs. Frankencar Midpipe Dyno Inside
12-12-2004, 09:09 AM
#1
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Stock MIDpipe Vs. Frankencar Midpipe Dyno Inside
Redline = Stock Midpipe
Green = Frankencar Midpipe
Used JWT popcharger.
Runs were done back to back. Stock Midpipe with JWT popcharger 1st then Frankencar Midpipe JWT popcharger.
Mods at time were Warpspeed Y-pipe, Catco Highflow Cat, Greddy SP catback, HyperGroud System.
http://memimage.cardomain.net/member...6_107_full.jpg
Last edited by NmexMAX; 06-12-2012 at 08:02 AM.
12-12-2004, 09:13 AM
#2
12-12-2004, 09:55 AM
#3
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Great dyno. Looks like I'm putting my stock back on. Looks like the stock midpipe gains about 4-5 hp over the aftermarket. It really comes in handy at about the 4k-5.3k range. And it doesn't look like it loses as much power as frankencar after 5.7k. Good job!
12-12-2004, 01:16 PM
#9
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yea seriously its 2 bad more people dont have the time or the money to really test these parts, it would be nice to know the acctual gain from differnt parts...id love to know what my ws y pipe is really doing, and any differnce the weapon R intake is makeing besides the loud noise(wanna go to k&n since the weapon r is TO loud!)
12-12-2004, 01:22 PM
#10
The y pipe is definitely adding a good amount of horses. I went back to the stock res and panel filter setup. I made swiss cheese out of the bottom part of the intake and threw in an Airhog filter.
I'm about to do the same with my Accord.
I'm about to do the same with my Accord.
12-12-2004, 01:53 PM
#13
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This was a curiosity test that myself and 98SEBlackMax did when i was at the dyno a coupe weeks ago. While peak numbers stayed almost the same some torque was lost in the lower RPM range with the Frankencar midpipe. The only real "gain" is the engine bay looked cleaner but no real performance gain.
From my own testing the STOCK midpipe makes more TQ.
From my own testing the STOCK midpipe makes more TQ.
12-12-2004, 03:17 PM
#14
Not DAVEB the parts guy
Join Date: Aug 2000
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Thank you testing this 
You confirmed what I've been trying to preach for over a year now, the stock resonator is a Helmholtz resonator and it actually improves driveability and that the additional noise you hear with a midpipe is actually intake resonance.....which isn't a good thing. That noise is turbulence in the manifold.
You confirmed what I've been trying to preach for over a year now, the stock resonator is a Helmholtz resonator and it actually improves driveability and that the additional noise you hear with a midpipe is actually intake resonance.....which isn't a good thing. That noise is turbulence in the manifold.
12-12-2004, 03:30 PM
#15
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Originally Posted by Dave B
Thank you testing this You confirmed what I've been trying to preach for over a year now, the stock resonator is a Helmholtz resonator and it actually improves driveability and that the additional noise you hear with a midpipe is actually intake resonance.....which isn't a good thing. That noise is turbulence in the manifold.
You confirmed what I've been trying to preach for over a year now, the stock resonator is a Helmholtz resonator and it actually improves driveability and that the additional noise you hear with a midpipe is actually intake resonance.....which isn't a good thing. That noise is turbulence in the manifold.
12-12-2004, 04:36 PM
#17
Originally Posted by zack342
This was a curiosity test that myself and 98SEBlackMax did when i was at the dyno a coupe weeks ago. While peak numbers stayed almost the same some torque was lost in the lower RPM range with the Frankencar midpipe. The only real "gain" is the engine bay looked cleaner but no real performance gain.
From my own testing the STOCK midpipe makes more TQ.
From my own testing the STOCK midpipe makes more TQ.
12-12-2004, 04:57 PM
#20
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yea if u dont mind emailing that to me i would like to add it to our info site on Limaximas.com
my email is
Alterman@hartford.edu
my email is
Alterman@hartford.edu
12-12-2004, 05:29 PM
#21
These runs were done back to back. We used the stock resonator first , then frankencar midpipe and saw the smaller numbers under the curve. After that we went back to the resonator. Now this is for a 4th gen USIM, would be interesting to see how it effects a MEVI.
12-12-2004, 06:07 PM
#23
Originally Posted by Dave B
Thank you testing this You confirmed what I've been trying to preach for over a year now, the stock resonator is a Helmholtz resonator and it actually improves driveability and that the additional noise you hear with a midpipe is actually intake resonance.....which isn't a good thing. That noise is turbulence in the manifold.
You confirmed what I've been trying to preach for over a year now, the stock resonator is a Helmholtz resonator and it actually improves driveability and that the additional noise you hear with a midpipe is actually intake resonance.....which isn't a good thing. That noise is turbulence in the manifold.
when I had it on, my butt dyno detected a very pikey powerband with dips and valleys and the throttle response was never as responsive as with the OEM resonator.
12-12-2004, 06:37 PM
#24
The real question is how to run nitrous with the stock midpipe. I can't imagine how to drill a reliable hole in the plastic....The Frankencar midpipe was thin enough....
And BTW- It's great someone finally did a dyno on this. So is the optimal intake setup a stock resonator with cut air filter box?
And BTW- It's great someone finally did a dyno on this. So is the optimal intake setup a stock resonator with cut air filter box?
12-12-2004, 06:53 PM
#25
gahhhhhh now i gotta resist the urge to buy the midpipe cause i know it will hurt my performance, but i want that sound so baddd. it makes my 4 cylinder friends tremble when my engine sounds so beastly compared to theirs. technically though the horsepower that you lose with a midpipe you cant even feel anyways since it would be so small, right?
12-12-2004, 08:09 PM
#26
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Wish i had more variations on this test but that's all i had at the time. I am certain that the stock midpipe is superior to the Frankencar or any other midpipes. i am not trying to tell anyone what to do just thought i would share what was observed on the DYNO. If you want the sound get the midpipe but if you wanna keep the TQ and ($80) keep your stock midpipe.
12-12-2004, 08:11 PM
#27
Good info zack... I had asked you what you learned on the dyno and never got any info back 
Thanks for taking your time to show us
I guess its goodbye to my frankencar... I bought a place racing CAI last week, I should be getting it this week
Thanks for taking your time to show us
I guess its goodbye to my frankencar... I bought a place racing CAI last week, I should be getting it this week
12-12-2004, 08:16 PM
#28
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Ok here is what i don't get....
In the stickies, it was said that a popcharger will give u gains in the high RPM area and sacrifice low end torque. On the other hand.....A HAI/WAI (Frankencar) will give the the higher RPM HP gains and not sacrifice as much low end; Basically give u good mid-range power.
So is the information in the stickies about these setups totally wrong (based on this dyno run)??
In the stickies, it was said that a popcharger will give u gains in the high RPM area and sacrifice low end torque. On the other hand.....A HAI/WAI (Frankencar) will give the the higher RPM HP gains and not sacrifice as much low end; Basically give u good mid-range power.
So is the information in the stickies about these setups totally wrong (based on this dyno run)??
12-12-2004, 08:29 PM
#29
Originally Posted by MaxxAddict
Ok here is what i don't get....
In the stickies, it was said that a popcharger will give u gains in the high RPM area and sacrifice low end torque. On the other hand.....A HAI/WAI (Frankencar) will give the the higher RPM HP gains and not sacrifice as much low end; Basically give u good mid-range power.
So is the information in the stickies about these setups totally wrong (based on this dyno run)??
In the stickies, it was said that a popcharger will give u gains in the high RPM area and sacrifice low end torque. On the other hand.....A HAI/WAI (Frankencar) will give the the higher RPM HP gains and not sacrifice as much low end; Basically give u good mid-range power.
So is the information in the stickies about these setups totally wrong (based on this dyno run)??
The idea behind popcharger or Frankentake is to shorten the length for the air to be sucked inside the engine. This in turn sharpens throttle response as well as high rpm breathing. But this does have a downfall, as low rpm is used, the shorten length creates turbulance within the pipe and you might loose some TQ. A CAI (PRCAI or Cattman CAI) has a long tube length to tune and smooth out the frequency and turbulance at lower rpms while also getting cooler air in the process. The reduced turbulance and cooler air in turn makes for good low-mid rpm power, but the longer tube will suffer once the engine is on the boil, it should make less TQ at higher rpms. Someone correct me if I'm wrong?
12-12-2004, 08:47 PM
#31
There was a huge intake thread, http://www.forums.maxima.org/showthr...t=dave+midpipe
and basically the org came to the conclusion that a mid mipe was a show only peice. No power was added.
Another resonator thread. http://www.forums.maxima.org/showthr...t=dave+midpipe
Then we were talking about throttle response and figured stock parts were better. http://www.forums.maxima.org/showthr...t=dave+midpipe
So Zack hit the nail on the head with this Dyno. I'm glad someone finally posted some hard evidence...I've been through so many HAI/hybrid setups. I've been running the mid pipe lately just for show, but the sounds has been getting on my nerves lately. Too loud for me some days. I've been thinking of running the stocker with a breather on the front valve cover so the blow by oil stays out of my intake manifold.
and basically the org came to the conclusion that a mid mipe was a show only peice. No power was added.
Another resonator thread. http://www.forums.maxima.org/showthr...t=dave+midpipe
Then we were talking about throttle response and figured stock parts were better. http://www.forums.maxima.org/showthr...t=dave+midpipe
So Zack hit the nail on the head with this Dyno. I'm glad someone finally posted some hard evidence...I've been through so many HAI/hybrid setups. I've been running the mid pipe lately just for show, but the sounds has been getting on my nerves lately. Too loud for me some days. I've been thinking of running the stocker with a breather on the front valve cover so the blow by oil stays out of my intake manifold.
12-12-2004, 09:49 PM
#33
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Originally Posted by JMooney5115
Would this be the case with all mid-pipes? I have a Weapon-R. Might look into going back to stock.
Mooney
Mooney
12-12-2004, 09:54 PM
#34
I would be interested to see if having a MEVI instead of the US manifold would benefit from different setups. To me it seems like the CAI or stock would be best for the stock manifold, but maybe a Frankencar design would be better for the MEVI (to 7000 rpm redline) since you stay in a higher rpm band where that design *may* shine...
It would have been awesome to also see a CAI in the dyno...
It would have been awesome to also see a CAI in the dyno...
12-12-2004, 09:58 PM
#35
I just bought an eBay knock off of the frankencar version. Sounds awesome at higher RPM's and I did drive at higher RPM's recently just to hear it. So naturally my gas mileage suffered but after two tank fulls, the gas mileage has suffered a LOT.
I went from roughly 280-300 miles/tank full to just under 200 (197 and the low gas light went ON) That's about 100 mile difference... this fact, compiled with the info from this thread means tomorrow I go back to stock.
Seems like the twisty, bendy stock system that seemed overly-complicated was designed that way for a reason. Good thing I didn't throw anything away.
Anybody wanna buy my eBay intake ?
I went from roughly 280-300 miles/tank full to just under 200 (197 and the low gas light went ON) That's about 100 mile difference... this fact, compiled with the info from this thread means tomorrow I go back to stock.
Seems like the twisty, bendy stock system that seemed overly-complicated was designed that way for a reason. Good thing I didn't throw anything away.
Anybody wanna buy my eBay intake ?
12-13-2004, 05:52 AM
#37
Originally Posted by 95maxrider
I would be interested to see if having a MEVI instead of the US manifold would benefit from different setups. To me it seems like the CAI or stock would be best for the stock manifold, but maybe a Frankencar design would be better for the MEVI (to 7000 rpm redline) since you stay in a higher rpm band where that design *may* shine...
It would have been awesome to also see a CAI in the dyno...
It would have been awesome to also see a CAI in the dyno...
12-13-2004, 07:24 AM
#40
Just curious but wouldn't the ecu need at least an hour or 2 to adjust to different velocities of different intake setups?
I don't doubt there are differences between the intakes on the dyno but doing the testing with one and immediately switching to another doesn't seem adequate for the ecu.
I would also like to point out that DaveB himself did actual testing AT THE TRACK with different setups and found vary little variances between the intakes. Maybe a .05 difference in 1/4 times.
I may be going back to the stock resonator soon as well...just wanted to point out that info.
I don't doubt there are differences between the intakes on the dyno but doing the testing with one and immediately switching to another doesn't seem adequate for the ecu.
I would also like to point out that DaveB himself did actual testing AT THE TRACK with different setups and found vary little variances between the intakes. Maybe a .05 difference in 1/4 times.
I may be going back to the stock resonator soon as well...just wanted to point out that info.