woot

to start I'm working with a 1990 Se manual. First off the speedometer works intermittently.The needle will jump up and down while it's at an idle, or when it decides to work it will bounce around. It hasn't worked in 6 months and decided to today. I tried taking the speed sensor out and putting it back in, no luck. It work when it decides to. Any ideas would be great.
Cruise control, the light on the button comes on, but the one on the instrument panel doesn't. I've checked all fuses and relays and cannot figure out why it will not work.Please help asap, as I am fixing to make a 300 mile one way trip

Levsimus

iTrader: (1)

I'm having a similar issue on mine. I've concluded it is likely the speedo but from what I've heard the speedo has no bearing on the cruise control. My odo and trip don't work either, rather they work randomly.

CapedCadaver

iTrader: (8)

Was the speedo working when you tried to use cruise control? Taking the VSS out and putting it back in doesn't really accomplish anything.. but the VSS might still be your problem, since both cruise and speedo are dependent on VSS.

Could also be your speedo tho. Usually, if the odometer is accurate (counting against mile markers on the highway) while your speedo is freaking out, then the problem would be your speedo. If the odometer is way off relative to the mile markers, then would probably be your VSS.

Also remember that there are some green rubber pads on the brake and clutch pedals that are responsible for pressing the cruise control cancel switches when the pedals are up. These pads like to deteriorate and disappear, causing cruise to stay permanently disengaged. They can also cause a no-start condition on a manual when the clutch is down (inhibitor switch on clutch pedal) and can cause your brake lights to stay on forever (brake light switch on brake pedal)... so look out for those:

CapedCadaver

iTrader: (8)

does your cruise actually work? The odometer and speedo all failing to work could be the VSS, if cruise control is also broken at the same time. The speedo and Cruise module don't send info to each other, but they do both share the same info source, the VSS. That isn't true for all makes/models (like my oldsmobile) but it is true at least for 3rd gen maximas.

And remember even if the sensor itself is good, the connectivity between the sensor and the rest of the car might not be. IE connectors and wiring.

Levsimus

iTrader: (1)

Well that's the wierd part, the speedo of course does its own thing and flails around at random at whatever speed it decides I'm going or its dead totally but the odo or trip meters seem independent of the speedo behavior. They'll count mileage while moving but not while stationary, even when I'm idling with the speedo posted up at 100mph. Then they'll randomly stop counting, start, stop.

I've pulled the dash apart to get the cluster out. Occasionally when the fuel gauge wigs out it'll peg out empty or full or random stuff.

Everything else seems fine. Not sure where the vss feeds to the cluster to trace the wiring for corrosion. Dash clock randomly runs fast too which may mean I've got a common ground somewhere gone bad.dunno where thatd be though.

woot

The trip and mileage work and are accurate. My cruise control has never worked,and the Speedo works sometimes. It is a 5 speed car and the rubber is still attached to the pedals,and the switches are releasing when the pedal is pushed. The brake is also engaging the switch good.

woot

My mileage will sometimes count while the car is just idling, seems like it does it more when it's cold outside

Levsimus

iTrader: (1)

Sage advice. I'm having parts hold off on ordering the used cluster, I need to figure out where to start to trace all my wiring before I start tossing parts at this thing. Any particularly notable grounds or connections to look at related to the speed sensor/gauge system?

woot

My exact thoughts. I don't wanna spend money and not fix anything. I had a couple of grounds that wasn't plugged in, but still nothing after fixing those

woot

Also will the 92-94 cluster fit the 90 model. I have access to a 92 cluster that I can test and see if the speedo will work

CapedCadaver

iTrader: (8)

yes any will fit all. The markings and faces/fonts are slightly different but they are all functionally correct. VE is 145mph, VG is 125mph. VE has higher redline.

when your odometer is "counting" at idle... what happens if you unplug the VSS then? Does it stop counting?

It's not to say the clusters never have failed gauges - they do. I had two of them. But if your intermittent condition happens frequently enough then you can usually narrow it down without replacing anything, and only replace something after you know the answer. Sometimes you don't get that lucky.

woot

To be honest I have never unplugged it while it was counting.If the problem occurs anytime soon I will unplug the sensor and see if the mileage still rolls over.

amixam 1992

I have interest in this thread, as my speedo is moody. Works when it feels like it. I also have no cruise control.

woot

Our cars are doing the same exact things. If you find a solution please let me know, I will do the same. I'm gonna take the cluster out this weekend and check wires and such, and also try to locate grounds that may be bad or not hooked up

Maxtastic GXE

In my 93 GXE auto when i would use my cruise, every so often the speedometer needle would bounce around the cruise light would start to flash and cruise stopped working. Id turn off cruise and the needle would start to work fine,I'd start to use cruise again and the problem would start right back up again. So i changed the VSS with another I had and it fixed the problem,now cruise and the speedo work like new. hope this helps.

woot

I'm in the process of trying to find a good used one instead of throwing out 100bucks for a new one. If anyone has one shoot me a price and I'll paypal you the cash

CapedCadaver

iTrader: (8)

auto and manual VSS are different lengths, i believe. So it will have to be one off a manual car.

woot

Right I should've included that I was in search for a sensor from a manual tranny. I have a post in the wanted section about it.

vernk

it's the gremlins....... check the circuit board and make sure it's not cracked, when I had my 89 the speedo would work when it wanted to..... turns out if your not careful pulling the cluster out to change the bulbs and put pressure on it to get it pass the steering steering column it will crack the board, I never had taken it out to check it and dont know if Cape ever looked at it but I'm sure thats was it was since the front cover was cracked, other then that check the grounds and the wires coming off the speed sensor....

CapedCadaver

iTrader: (8)

immediately after getting that car from you, i swapped the cluster into my GXE. This is a video if it misbehaving like 3 days later. It was registering 1/3rd of actual speed (showed 15mph = real 45mph). I never ended up investigating or fixing it, and I think that cluster is gone now. A lot of my stuff got thrown out in 2009.

woot

I'll be pulling the cluster tmr. I don't see a ground coming from the speed sensor, only thing I have is the wires coming directly out of it

vernk

yea check those and make sure they are not shorting out or broke, and the grounds in the dash like where the cluster is grounded, be sure to check the switchs on the brake and clutch for the cruise issue...

CapedCadaver

iTrader: (8)

VSS signal is AC/pulse, so there is no ground. It's just got a spinning magnet and a reed switch

woot

I have a guy with a speed sensor from a 92 ve wanting to sell. I'm guessing this is also work in my 90?

CapedCadaver

iTrader: (8)

This is how they interchange. It's ambiguous for the 92 manuals.

http://www.courtesyparts.com/kb_sear...1611_1677_1693

woot

Nothing came up for that link. I'll keep my wanted ad up just in case someone pops up with one for a 90.

CapedCadaver

iTrader: (8)

Try again. I fixeded it. the [ ] brackets in the URL itself parsed funny.

woot

I don't see anything at this site that tells me whether the 92 will work on the 90. Maybe I am just looking over it though?

woot

So I started the Max this morning and noticed that the Trip was running while it was at an Idle, I unplugged the speed sensor and it quit counting, so I plugged it back in and it started counting again. Any thought?!?!

CapedCadaver

iTrader: (8)

the years are like.... right there



but one of them says 89-92 M/T, the other says 92-94 M/T, so there is techincally a possibility for overlap between them. But I believe 89-92 should really read 89-91 for M/T and A/T because that's when all 3rd gens had a VG engine and associated transmission (RS5F50A and RE4F02A). VE is RS5F50V and RE4F04V.

I assume however that the 92 will not work on a 90, since all M/T are (originally from) SE cars, therefore the 92 M/T sensor is out of a VE, and your 90 is a VG... so the gear ratios won't match.

woot

I think I've located one from a 90. Whats your thoughts on it counting when it's plugged in and not counting when it's unplugged

CapedCadaver

iTrader: (8)

When you unplug the VSS what voltage do you get on each pin? 12 on one, 0 on the other? (i'm not 100% sure what it's supposed to be but might be able to check mine later). The diagram for the VSS is slightly vague as to how the electricity moves... but maybe yours is internally shorted or something, causing an "always on" signal to go to the speedometer rather than a pulsed signal like it's supposed to produce.

woot

I'll just wait on the other one to get here and see what happens when I put it in

LQ91SE

I would try a new cluster before a speed sensor. A new cluster fixed my dead/bouncing speedo needle, but after I had spent $120+ on a new sensor from Courtesy Parts.

CapedCadaver

iTrader: (8)

eh... the odometer is driven by the speedometer. If the speedometer was flaky then unplugging his VSS shouldn't have made any difference in the phantom odometer counting, right? Plus it wouldn't prevent his cruise from working.

woot

Well I put the Speed sensor in and the speedo is still not working. I drove it a few miles yesterday and the speedo jumped several times but never actually worked. Guess I'll try another speedo now

CapedCadaver

iTrader: (8)

a replacement speed sensor? what about cruise control? is that still broken as well?

woot

Cruise still doesn't work, and neither does the MPH gauge.

woot

I've also been reading about the ASCD switch and relay. Does the symptoms I'm having relate to this sensor or relay being bad?

woot

Well I came out to go to work this morning and Speedometer worked until I turned the car off.It hasn't even budged since then.I'm leaning toward something in the cluster. I also noticed that when I hit a hard bump my Temp hand drops out,then goes back to normal operating temp, even more of a reason I think it's the cluster