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I have finally finished getting the swap complete, but I am have a few issues. Could I have some ideas from the gurus, et.al.?
A little background:
My original car is a 90SE and the donor car is a 93SE. I swapped the wiring harness for the ECU along with the ECU for obvious reasons. I did not swap the rest of the wiring harness, as I didn't think I needed to. (am I wrong here?) I swapped radiators and cooling fans also as the donors' were in better shape.
OK, to the problems:
1) Before the swap my cooling fans operated properly. Post swap they run all the time when the ignition switch is on.
2) Oil pressure switch on the VG was on the back side of the motor next to the oil filter. Oil pressure switch on the VE is on the front side of the motor next to the oil filter. The problem here is that there is no plug that goes to motor from the car. Not a huge problem, as I could run a manual oil pressure guage.
3) I can not get the car to crank. It turns over fine. Matter of fact, it was running before I pulled it. The coils are firing, but I am not so sure I am getting gas. The reason I say this is because it turns over evenly like it isn't trying to crank but will run the battery down fairly quickly. (I have worked on cars before that were not firing and this is not what it sounds like) Also, during one of the days I was not able to work on it, the weather took a turn for the worse and blew off the tarp I had covering it and then rained on the motor. Needless to say, all the connectors that are on top of the motor got soaked to the point they had water in them. I tried to use WD40 to float the water out and then dry this out with towels. I believe I got the most out, just not sure I got all of it.
That is all I can think of right now. please, Please, PLEASE help me.
I'd say you are the "guru" considering nobody (here at least) has ever done a VG/VE swap. Unfortunately, because of this, you are pretty much on your own unless you want random ideas thrown at you.
You say it is "not cranking" but talk about it turning over fine and plugs sparking.. That's kind of confusing, i'm assuming it "cranks", but won't start opposed to no "crank" at all (dead starter). Anyway, trial and error time. Unless the ECU will throw some codes at you.
Anyway man, congratulations on the swap. Hopefully you can work out the bugs and get it on the road
I have finally finished getting the swap complete, but I am have a few issues. Could I have some ideas from the gurus, et.al.?
A little background:
My original car is a 90SE and the donor car is a 93SE. I swapped the wiring harness for the ECU along with the ECU for obvious reasons. I did not swap the rest of the wiring harness, as I didn't think I needed to. (am I wrong here?) I swapped radiators and cooling fans also as the donors' were in better shape.
OK, to the problems:
1) Before the swap my cooling fans operated properly. Post swap they run all the time when the ignition switch is on.
2) Oil pressure switch on the VG was on the back side of the motor next to the oil filter. Oil pressure switch on the VE is on the front side of the motor next to the oil filter. The problem here is that there is no plug that goes to motor from the car. Not a huge problem, as I could run a manual oil pressure guage.
3) I can not get the car to crank. It turns over fine. Matter of fact, it was running before I pulled it. The coils are firing, but I am not so sure I am getting gas. The reason I say this is because it turns over evenly like it isn't trying to crank but will run the battery down fairly quickly. (I have worked on cars before that were not firing and this is not what it sounds like) Also, during one of the days I was not able to work on it, the weather took a turn for the worse and blew off the tarp I had covering it and then rained on the motor. Needless to say, all the connectors that are on top of the motor got soaked to the point they had water in them. I tried to use WD40 to float the water out and then dry this out with towels. I believe I got the most out, just not sure I got all of it.
That is all I can think of right now. please, Please, PLEASE help me.
Thanks in advance!
when you say you swapped the ECU harness did you swap the entire harness that goes to the motor and the ECU or just cut off the end and are splicing things in as you go?
as far as the fans go, check your CTS
if your oil pressure switch is not connected I believe it cuts power to the fuel pump.
96 Green A/T gone
94 Pathfinder POS GONE! | 79 Camaro sold
98 I30t Silver on black A/T gone | 96 Granite Pearl (AKA Purple) A/T gone
92 grey VE A/T gone | 96 I30 Black gone
92 maroon VE A/T gone | 92 white VE M/T gone
92 grey VE A/T gone | 6/84 L24E last of the RWD Maxima gone
Cooling fans in high speed mode constantly with the ignition switch in the ON position (a/c on or off) is one of the symptoms of a failed ECU. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if the injectors are clogged. Depends on if the rail had fuel in it while the engine was sitting around or not.
__________________
Tuning a car isn't a crime, but spelling it "tunning" ought to be. - ....
when you say you swapped the ECU harness did you swap the entire harness that goes to the motor and the ECU or just cut off the end and are splicing things in as you go?
as far as the fans go, check your CTS
if your oil pressure switch is not connected I believe it cuts power to the fuel pump.
Yeah, splicin' wiring harnesses can cause endless problems. I had some similar questions about this swap regarding the retainer of the VE wiring harness in another thread on the site. The answer was emphatic: DON'T MIX THE WIRING HARNESSES! VG for VG; VE for VE. Trying to backtrack if this was the path you took may be more trouble than it's worth. Get a complete original VE harness and good ECU.
__________________
Always be a Gentleman, but when
all else fails, kick some A.
I'd say you are the "guru" considering nobody (here at least) has ever done a VG/VE swap. Unfortunately, because of this, you are pretty much on your own unless you want random ideas thrown at you.
You say it is "not cranking" but talk about it turning over fine and plugs sparking.. That's kind of confusing, i'm assuming it "cranks", but won't start opposed to no "crank" at all (dead starter). Anyway, trial and error time. Unless the ECU will throw some codes at you.
Anyway man, congratulations on the swap. Hopefully you can work out the bugs and get it on the road
Hectic, that is exactly what it is doing, it "cranks" just doesn't act like it wants to fire up and run.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hectic
Oh yeah, lets see some pics
If you have seen a 3rd gen with a VE it looks the same as one that has been swapped in. Looks like it came from the factory.
Quote:
Originally Posted by internetautomar
when you say you swapped the ECU harness did you swap the entire harness that goes to the motor and the ECU or just cut off the end and are splicing things in as you go?
as far as the fans go, check your CTS
if your oil pressure switch is not connected I believe it cuts power to the fuel pump.
Brian, I swapped the complete harness. I did not want to do any splicing and I succeeded in that.
I am a noob with the lingo, what is a CTS.
You may be on to something about the oil pressure switch, but in pulling the VG out one of my sons' friends helped me and unfortunately the OPS did not get disconnected from the engine and that plug broke off around the harness on the drivers side. If I had some help locating where that comes out of the VG harness I might be able to rig something up there.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nismology
Cooling fans in high speed mode constantly with the ignition switch in the ON position (a/c on or off) is one of the symptoms of a failed ECU. Also, I wouldn't be surprised if the injectors are clogged. Depends on if the rail had fuel in it while the engine was sitting around or not.
I highly doubt that the ECU is bad or that the injectors are clogged as I was driving the donor car up until last week. The connectors that go to the fans are part of the harness that remains from the 90 model. I wonder if there is a difference between 90 and 93 models in the wiring department?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mack531
Yeah, splicin' wiring harnesses can cause endless problems. I had some similar questions about this swap regarding the retainer of the VE wiring harness in another thread on the site. The answer was emphatic: DON'T MIX THE WIRING HARNESSES! VG for VG; VE for VE. Trying to backtrack if this was the path you took may be more trouble than it's worth. Get a complete original VE harness and good ECU.
Again, I did swap the entire harness between the enigine and the ECU to avoid splicing. Heck, I even went as far as to swap AC compressors because the electrical connector was different between them.
Something else comes to mind.....
On the 90VG, there is one fusebox under the hood. On the 93VE there is like three under there. If I have to swap the harness to get all of the fuseboxes, that will mean the ENTIRE freaking harness for the car will have to be swapped. Someone put me out of my misery and tell me I do not need those other two fuseboxes. LOL
I know that everyone will believe I have actually made the swap with pictures, but how can I prove the car actually had a VG to start with? I do not have any pics of before the swap so......
I can take pics of all the mess out in my back yard if that will suffice. LOL
Damn dude, thats a lot of work. Congrats on at least getting this far. having the OPS will not cut the fuel pump off...at least not on the VG and I know cuz mine has been disconnected for some time and its been too cold to plug it back. And its also very bad to have it unplugged
Let us know how it goes
__________________ SHIFT_I cant it's Automatic!!
1993 Maxima GXE Super White, Ebay FSTB, 97-99 SE Rims, KYB GR2s, BlehmCo Lower Tiebar, BlehmCo parallel link kit, RSTB, BlehmCo swaybar links,Rear Addco swaybar, z31 rear disc upgrade, Assurance TripleTreds.
1995 Maxima GXE-5 Dark Blue Pearl , 00-01 SE RIMs, I30 leather w/rear headrests, No rubber- all ES Poly in front end suspension, Pioneer InDash Navi, Kzoosho LED tails and FX35 HID retrofit
Damn dude, thats a lot of work. Congrats on at least getting this far. having the OPS will not cut the fuel pump off...at least not on the VG and I know cuz mine has been disconnected for some time and its been too cold to plug it back. And its also very bad to have it unplugged
Let us know how it goes
I hope you are correct about the OPS. Also, isn't your max a 93? If so, how many fuseboxes do you have under the hood? This is the biggest difference I have seen thus far between the 90 and the 93.
I will definitely let everyone know how it progresses.
__________________ 2000 Maxima SE -- Black -- Blonde Leather
I hope you are correct about the OPS. Also, isn't your max a 93? If so, how many fuseboxes do you have under the hood? This is the biggest difference I have seen thus far between the 90 and the 93.
I will definitely let everyone know how it progresses.
Yes I have a 93 but its a GXE which = VG. I'm got 2 relay boxed. One below battery and one on side of it by fender. My gfs 89 SE has same amount on same locations. I'm thinking its a VG/VE difference and not so much year difference.
__________________ SHIFT_I cant it's Automatic!!
1993 Maxima GXE Super White, Ebay FSTB, 97-99 SE Rims, KYB GR2s, BlehmCo Lower Tiebar, BlehmCo parallel link kit, RSTB, BlehmCo swaybar links,Rear Addco swaybar, z31 rear disc upgrade, Assurance TripleTreds.
1995 Maxima GXE-5 Dark Blue Pearl , 00-01 SE RIMs, I30 leather w/rear headrests, No rubber- all ES Poly in front end suspension, Pioneer InDash Navi, Kzoosho LED tails and FX35 HID retrofit
If you have seen a 3rd gen with a VE it looks the same as one that has been swapped in. Looks like it came from the factory.
I was requesting proof. A handful of newbs come here claiming they have just finished large, custom projects to earn face quickly. Not that I don't believe you or anything, but nobody has ever bothered to complete this swap, surely you have some pics to show your hard work
i think pics of the mounts would be informative.
I hear this is the biggest part of a swap is the engine/tranny mounts.
if we could see pics of how people conquered this obstacle, then others may be inclined to undertake this as well.
when you get the car running, let us know what some of the things you had to do to make the swap work...
i think pics of the mounts would be informative.
I hear this is the biggest part of a swap is the engine/tranny mounts.
if we could see pics of how people conquered this obstacle, then others may be inclined to undertake this as well.
when you get the car running, let us know what some of the things you had to do to make the swap work...
They are different but they bolt on just like the VG ones would on a VG engine
__________________ SHIFT_I cant it's Automatic!!
1993 Maxima GXE Super White, Ebay FSTB, 97-99 SE Rims, KYB GR2s, BlehmCo Lower Tiebar, BlehmCo parallel link kit, RSTB, BlehmCo swaybar links,Rear Addco swaybar, z31 rear disc upgrade, Assurance TripleTreds.
1995 Maxima GXE-5 Dark Blue Pearl , 00-01 SE RIMs, I30 leather w/rear headrests, No rubber- all ES Poly in front end suspension, Pioneer InDash Navi, Kzoosho LED tails and FX35 HID retrofit
if your oil pressure switch is not connected I believe it cuts power to the fuel pump.
not on my 92 se, i installed a auto meter oil pressure, and totally unhooked the factory sending unit and harnesss. runs fine without it, no light even comes on. which i though was kinda weird. i figured it would realize A)its unhooked or b) there is no oil pressure.
__________________ 336-338-3570
HAVE:
2002 SE 6Speed KH3
2002 SE Auto
HAD:
1985300ZX5Speed
1992SEAutoAztecRed
1992SE5SpeedKH3
1990SE5SpeedPartscar
1987SE5Speed Started it all!
i think pics of the mounts would be informative.
I hear this is the biggest part of a swap is the engine/tranny mounts.
if we could see pics of how people conquered this obstacle, then others may be inclined to undertake this as well.
when you get the car running, let us know what some of the things you had to do to make the swap work...
It is a VG - VE swap. No major mods in this one.....yet. LOL
Quote:
Originally Posted by BlooToof
Yes I have a 93 but its a GXE which = VG. I'm got 2 relay boxed. One below battery and one on side of it by fender. My gfs 89 SE has same amount on same locations. I'm thinking its a VG/VE difference and not so much year difference.
Yes, I knew you had a VG. That is why I was wondering how many fuse/relay boxes you had under the hood. Looks like I got some more swapping out to do as the 90 only has two and the 93 has three. Argh!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hectic
I was requesting proof. A handful of newbs come here claiming they have just finished large, custom projects to earn face quickly. Not that I don't believe you or anything, but nobody has ever bothered to complete this swap, surely you have some pics to show your hard work
I figured that was what you were getting at. No problem. I will take pics of the carnage out on my drive, but when I am working the last thing on my mind is to take pics as I am doing something. Now for some verbal confirmation, you can ask oldngivout. He has been on the forum for quite a while. I actually went to his house and bought the donor car. Other than that you will just have to wait.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greeny
good luck with that...
BAWAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Greeny, I thought you might have some valuable/useful information. If we got off on the wrong foot, I did not mean to. I could really use some advice/help here. Please?
Quote:
Originally Posted by SurraTT
not on my 92 se, i installed a auto meter oil pressure, and totally unhooked the factory sending unit and harnesss. runs fine without it, no light even comes on. which i though was kinda weird. i figured it would realize A)its unhooked or b) there is no oil pressure.
Thanks, that helps me tons....really it does. I will just go get me a manual gauge and forget trying to figure out the idiot light. That is, unless I have to swap out the other part of the wiring harness.
So....can someone tell me that has or has had a VE where the harness goes to that connects to the relay box on the PS of the engine bay? As in, where does it go to inside the car?
__________________ 2000 Maxima SE -- Black -- Blonde Leather
I will be glad to take a few pics and do a little electrical routing foot work tomorrow,as long as you do your part and read the el section of the FSM..
I figured that was what you were getting at. No problem. I will take pics of the carnage out on my drive, but when I am working the last thing on my mind is to take pics as I am doing something. Now for some verbal confirmation, you can ask oldngivout. He has been on the forum for quite a while. I actually went to his house and bought the donor car. Other than that you will just have to wait.
not on my 92 se, i installed a auto meter oil pressure, and totally unhooked the factory sending unit and harnesss. runs fine without it, no light even comes on. which i though was kinda weird. i figured it would realize A)its unhooked or b) there is no oil pressure.
dam that was ax-backwards of nissan. they had it to cut fuel on my 84 max.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mike90se
I am a noob with the lingo, what is a CTS.
Coolant Temperature Sensor
FWIW the CTS may be contributing to your starting issue, though it is unlikely
96 Green A/T gone
94 Pathfinder POS GONE! | 79 Camaro sold
98 I30t Silver on black A/T gone | 96 Granite Pearl (AKA Purple) A/T gone
92 grey VE A/T gone | 96 I30 Black gone
92 maroon VE A/T gone | 92 white VE M/T gone
92 grey VE A/T gone | 6/84 L24E last of the RWD Maxima gone
No, I live in Fort Payne, AL. I bought some seats from him once when his daughter wrecked her 3rd gen. Anywho, I think you actually live closer to me than you do him. LOL
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greeny
I will be glad to take a few pics and do a little electrical routing foot work tomorrow,as long as you do your part and read the el section of the FSM..
My FSM is mostly pics. I think it is messed up. I do not see any documentation as far as steps to do stuff.
__________________ 2000 Maxima SE -- Black -- Blonde Leather
I figured that was what you were getting at. No problem. I will take pics of the carnage out on my drive, but when I am working the last thing on my mind is to take pics as I am doing something. Now for some verbal confirmation, you can ask oldngivout. He has been on the forum for quite a while. I actually went to his house and bought the donor car. Other than that you will just have to wait.
Heh, man I believe you, i'm not gonna go hunting down people making sure you did it or not. I was half joking in asking for pics. No need to post pics of the remains, mid swap pics would be nice though. Taking pics during big projects is a good thing to do IMO, it allows you to take a look back at all the hard work you put into projects after the fact.. But I agree, it can be tough to stop and take the pics while you're in the middle of a project. Smoke breaks are a good time for that though..
dam that was ax-backwards of nissan. they had it to cut fuel on my 84 max.
Coolant Temperature Sensor
FWIW the CTS may be contributing to your starting issue, though it is unlikely
Thanks, all this was working before I pulled the motor. Not saying that it has not gone out since, but that would be really weird.
I am afraid I have narrowed it down to the fact that my 90 does not have the relay box on the PS of the engine bay that the 93 does. It has a relay in it for the injectors and/or coils in it. I am afraid my wiring issues are not complete.
__________________ 2000 Maxima SE -- Black -- Blonde Leather
Heh, man I believe you, i'm not gonna go hunting down people making sure you did it or not. I was half joking in asking for pics. No need to post pics of the remains, mid swap pics would be nice though. Taking pics during big projects is a good thing to do IMO, it allows you to take a look back at all the hard work you put into projects after the fact.. But I agree, it can be tough to stop and take the pics while you're in the middle of a project. Smoke breaks are a good time for that though..
Well, I had planned to take pics all along the project, but it has been so pharkin' COLD every time I have had the chance to work on it that all I could think of was to "git 'er done!"
Tell, you what, I will do my best at a write up once, I get it running. OK?
__________________ 2000 Maxima SE -- Black -- Blonde Leather
No, I live in Fort Payne, AL. I bought some seats from him once when his daughter wrecked her 3rd gen. Anywho, I think you actually live closer to me than you do him. LOL
meh,139 from you/115 from him..
Quote:
My FSM is mostly pics. I think it is messed up. I do not see any documentation as far as steps to do stuff.
Heh...The fsm doesn't have swap instructions,
I was referring to all the wiring diagrams and harness routing diagrams in the mentioned sections.take a good look at EL-180/EL-181 in the fsm,just to see if you have all the plugs in the right place..i may be able to come down and give you a hand if you can't figure it out yourself.
I was referring to all the wiring diagrams and harness routing diagrams in the mentioned sections.take a good look at EL-180/EL-181 in the fsm,just to see if you have all the plugs in the right place..i may be able to come down and give you a hand if you can't figure it out yourself.
Ok, I will give it a looksee. The one good thing Nissan did that I can tell, is most all plugs are unique...as in an Id10t like me can't screw them up.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike90SE
I am afraid I have narrowed it down to the fact that my 90 does not have the relay box on the PS of the engine bay that the 93 does. It has a relay in it for the injectors and/or coils in it. I am afraid my wiring issues are not complete.
This is what I told Brian a few minutes ago. The more I think about it, the more I feel this is my problem. What I was wondering without digging through the FSM, was where the drivers side of the harness goes. As in does it go all the way to the gas tank, or just up under the dash, or is it all the rest of the wires under the dash. But.....I will see if I can make heads or tails of the schematics. LOL I am a computer geek dangit, not an electrical one. LOL
__________________ 2000 Maxima SE -- Black -- Blonde Leather
I am a computer geek dangit, not an electrical one. LOL
one computer geek to another, its all just troubleshooting. we just gotta learn how to describe the symptoms, figure out what causes the symptoms, figure out what causes that, and fix what is nesecary! 'cause thats what us geeks do on my end.
This is what I told Brian a few minutes ago. The more I think about it, the more I feel this is my problem. What I was wondering without digging through the FSM, was where the drivers side of the harness goes. As in does it go all the way to the gas tank, or just up under the dash, or is it all the rest of the wires under the dash. But.....I will see if I can make heads or tails of the schematics. LOL I am a computer geek dangit, not an electrical one. LOL
Well,I'll see what i can come up with tomorrow..
just for reference,you ARE getting spark...NOT getting fuel,right?
ok i'm home from work now, the relay box on the PS side has a relay for ignition coil. The motor does not wizz over like its not getting fire, meaning it is getting fire. So it sounds like something to do with the fuel, possibly the liquid that is in the fuel injector connections causing them to short?? maybe?? i dunno??
__________________ 2000 Maxima SE -- Black -- Blonde Leather
ok i'm home from work now, the relay box on the PS side has a relay for ignition coil. The motor does not wizz over like its not getting fire, meaning it is getting fire. So it sounds like something to do with the fuel,
So you have verified that you are definitely getting spark,or are you just guessing? same with fuel(have you verified?)
Quote:
possibly the liquid that is in the fuel injector connections causing them to short?? maybe?? i dunno??
It's possible
If you have access to a leaf blower,use it to dry out the engine/connectors.
So you have verified that you are definitely getting spark,or are you just guessing? same with fuel(have you verified?)
Well, I haven't grabbed a hold of one of the coils and let someone turn the motor.
I guess you can say I am guessing. I do know I am going to have to replace the the coils as 4 of the 6 are cracked. I could hear what I thought was spark arcing. I know that doesn't mean that I am actually getting spark to the plugs...but I am getting spark somewhere.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Greeny
It's possible
If you have access to a leaf blower,use it to dry out the engine/connectors.
I do not have a leaf blower, but I do have plenty of the compressed air that is used to blow out computers. Will that work?
I have been looking the FSM over, and if I am correct, the DS of the harness connects right at the fuse box in the dash. So maybe this won't be as bad as I am imagining it is going to be.
__________________ 2000 Maxima SE -- Black -- Blonde Leather
So you have verified that you are definitely getting spark,or are you just guessing? same with fuel(have you verified?)
It's possible
If you have access to a leaf blower,use it to dry out the engine/connectors.
I'm just wondering here, but do the VG and VE engines require an in-the-fuel-tank electric fuel pump that is unique to the engine? Do the injectors have different pressue requirements? This is one part that probably wasn't swapped-- am I right?
__________________
Always be a Gentleman, but when
all else fails, kick some A.
I'm just wondering here, but do the VG and VE engines require an in-the-fuel-tank electric fuel pump that is unique to the engine? Do the injectors have different pressue requirements? This is one part that probably wasn't swapped-- am I right?
Well, looking at idiotzone's website the pumps are definitely different, but what is odd is the fact that the VG pump is like $298 and the VE is $84.
And you are correct.....at this point I have not swapped it.....but I will if I have to.
God it is great having a running donor car.
__________________ 2000 Maxima SE -- Black -- Blonde Leather
I'm just wondering here, but do the VG and VE engines require an in-the-fuel-tank electric fuel pump that is unique to the engine? Do the injectors have different pressue requirements? This is one part that probably wasn't swapped-- am I right?
you might have hit on something there,the vg/ve pumps are different(fuel pressure wise),but I'm not sure if it's enough to prevent the car from starting/running..
)
Please?
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