bonzelite

iTrader: (2)

a friend and i narrowed down a problem during the course of the afternoon by process of elimnation: after a tune up and other checks that did not help, we tapped on the injectors and found that one of them would cut on and off, sort of hesitate then come alive when tapped as the engine smoothed out then got rough again (sometimes). anyway, we are convinced the injector is causing the sh!tty idle and power loss.

given that, because the entire intake manifold and some of the **** connected to it must be removed, which is not a small a job, should we just replace all of the injectors? the car has 178K miles and the injectors have never been replaced. i fear that if i just piece-meal, one-by-one, replacing single injectors, in the long run, i will spend more time and money because i will have to remove the intake manifold again and again and again until all 6 are new. so, expensive as those little sons of b!tches are, should i just get all new ones? and have a clear mind about it?

the situation sucks no matter what, so what would you do?

Nismomaxt

Have you tried injector cleaner? Had that problem with another nissan of mine and the cleaner cleared the problem after about 3 tank fills.
Costs me about 15 bucks (bought the good stuff). If its really trashed and that doesn't work, replace them all, for peace-of-mind.

Chris91SE

iTrader: (1)

are you tapping the injector or the on the harness? the harness could probably have corrosion and dirt on it. try cleaning the connections first...

if the wires/rubber seems worn or cracked start with replacing the whole injector harness.

if you're hell bent on replacing the injector then just do all 6 at once

CandiMan

iTrader: (1)

My/myself and I would change all six if you can afford it. But that's me

Tom

When my injectors went bad at 146K miles, I made sure the connectors were clean and also did a resistance check. Based on the resistance check, I found 2 of the injectors to be bad. So I replaced just those 2 (and yes, these things are expensive at the dealer). I put everything back together and it was fine.

I have almost 156K miles now and it still runs just fine. Be sure to measure the resistance!

bonzelite

iTrader: (2)

gentlemen, you're great. i will try to clean the injectors first. if no dice, then they all get yanked and replaced. we did clean the terminal end of the wire of the problematic injector. and it was no dice. maybe i should replace the injector harness as well.

btw >> chris and candiman, your cars look really good. dope.

bonzelite

iTrader: (2)

tom, i will check resistance. there may be more lurking problems. that is what you are saying.

tmuscedere

On my car I had one doing the same thing as you describe. I didn't want to be taking the intake on and off more than once. I bought a set of rebuilts from www.directauto.com they were 40 bucks a piece. Its been one year since i replaced them and the car runs much better now.

shoult

iTrader: (1)

Rather then replacing all six (VERY expensive) you could just send them out to a place like RC Engineering and have them Balanced and Blueprinted for about $25 each. If they are fixable what you get back is better then what the factory put in originally.

I had a set done on another car and here is their report on my injectors....

http://www.mr2sc.com/websites/vin-pa...njectors-L.jpg

These injectors are rated at 365cc/min and you can see all but one of them exceed that rating. You'll also notice that for spray patterns 2 were good and two only fair.

What I got back were injectors that flow 380.x cc/min and all have excellent patterens.

In use they made a world of difference.

I would suggest you go to a junk yard and get a used set to send in and have them done so you don't have to have your car of the road for a few days.

shoult

iTrader: (1)

RC Engineering website is www.rceng.com

phast92se

i was planning on changing my injectors soon but didnt realize it would cost that much....if i go to a junkyard to get injectors to send in, do i have to get the injectors from the exact same car, as in a 92 SE, or can i also get them from the 93 or 94 GXEs???

sorry if it seems im tryin to take over your thread, bonzelite

shoult

iTrader: (1)

You'll have to have them from a SE.

phast92se

aight... thats what i thought but i wasnt for sure.... does the year matter too?? like can they be from a 92 or 93 or 94??

bonzelite

iTrader: (2)

phast92se

my view is that the thread is for everyone. so don't worry bout it, dude. thanks for your consideration, though.

if i can learn something from someone else's situation and know-how, then all the better. it makes the thread all the more valuable.

phast92se

cool beans man... jus thought id put that there jus in case, cuz some ppl might get a little perturbed... i think thats how you spell it...

bonzelite

iTrader: (2)

so. here is the story so far: i went to G&A foreign dismantlers on Balboa. i got 6 injectors from a 91 GXE. the guy said it did not matter if i had the SE. i then challenged his view as devil's advocate, but he insisted that the engine is the same with injectors. so i believed him. they all cost $150 before tax. they left them on the rails.

i then went to RC engineering in Torrance. i fought traffic and my dead cylinder/injector (prolly really bad to drive like that but i had few options, i could have taken a cab for about $240). i showed the guy the whole assembly and he looked like i was from jupiter: they do not service injectors that are still on the rails. but since i was not about to remotely consider driving all the way home to just remove them, i then said "i will bribe you." he said "how much?" and i looked on into space. he then said "40 dollars." i then said "ok."

today is friday. so i can pick them up on monday. final bill, including bribe, is $211 incl. tax. + the $160-ish (after tax price) for the injectors, and i have thus far spent about $371 >> still far cheaper than buying new ones.

now i must pour over the haynes manual to figure out how to dismantle the intake manifold from the top of the engine without mishap.

Tom

That's one nice thing about living in Southern Cal. All the cool shops are within driving distance. I live in Seattle now and miss living down there (I grew up in Huntington Beach).

BTW, what year SE do you have?

Also, since you picked up all 6 injectors from one car, it shouldn't matter, but if anyone decides to buy injectors one by one (at the dealer). It comes with either blue or black dot. You can't mix and match from what I was told.

CandiMan

iTrader: (1)

What exactly is RC engineering going to do with the injectors. Are they going to rebuild and/or clean the injectors along with the before and after flow test. To me if they're only cleaning the internals of the injectors (like over the counter inj cleaner but 10x better) that's not considered rebuilding (changing the seals, pintle valve, o-ring, etc)

bonzelite

iTrader: (2)

tom, i have a 90SE. i will look for the blue or black dot, too. if i cannot use them, then i will just (attempt to) sell them and get new ones.

candiman, see shoult's posts on this thread and/or go to www.rceng.com
i was not really under the illusion that they would do a tear-down/rebuild. they recalibrate the spray shape and pattern to factory spec. a question arises: what causes an injector to die if it is not the connection/wiring problem besides buildup?

also, for the record, as i was clueless beforehand, the injectors on the VG are "side feed."

CandiMan

iTrader: (1)

Did you get the ProCal or the Standard injector service. The ProCal looks to be more hype than anything, at least for us avg enthusiates. Just another way of getting more money. Besides a connection/wiring problem and deposit build-up another form of injector failure could be the inj coil windings itself. Due to being subjected to heat, coil windings have been known to fail. Just ask those RWD V8 guys how many starters have they replaced due to the hearders being so close to the starters. For this very same reason you can never know how long a "rebuild" inj may last. Becasue I'm sure when injectors are rebuild everything like seals, o-rings, valves, etc. are replaced, all except for the coil winding. Even though the windings probably passed the testing process. If the coil windings were replaced at that point they'll be considered new instead of rebuild injectors.

bonzelite

iTrader: (2)

it seems that just getting factory new injectors is the ideal way to go. the coil windings of used injectors are compromised due to age and heat. new ones will be fresh and can last another 13 years or more. perhaps i should just get fresh ones. but now i face spending even more cash. but that may be the price of an education. or maybe i will just use the damn used ones afterall. and if they fail, then they fail. i can cross that bridge again. the prob with used things is that it is often only a bandaid. typically, i replace things with new or nearly new parts, so i went against my own rule this time in an effort to save some money. then again, i feel that these used ones will function normally and serve me well enough for at least a good while.

we shall see.

bonzelite

iTrader: (2)

i got the standard service. not procal.

CandiMan

iTrader: (1)

I wouldn't stop to buy new injectors. Many have purchased used/rebuilt injectors with good results for years. As you mentioned it's a learning process that you'll have with you for the next time. Besides ohming out the coil windings there's pretty much nothing else you can do to check the windings. Maybe you can give RC a call and ask them if they or can they ohm out the injectors just to see. I can't imagine they charging you to do that, or maybe that's a normal part of there process.

bonzelite

iTrader: (2)

candiman

i will go through with the used/recalibrated idea as i am already invested in it. in a way, i have little choice at this point as i have begun the process. i think i would have never entertained the remote idea of using used/recal'd injectors if i was overly skeptical. and i was going, too, on good first hand accounts of people who posted here.

i went out and bought a 'digital multimeter' it measures ac/dc voltage, ohms, batt, dca. now, in the haynes manual, i cannot for the life of me find the proper range of resistance in ohms for the injectors (as i want to know if any are truly dead or not). the book says "if the resistance is in the specified range..." but there is no range specified! anywhere! maybe i need a factory service manual. those are far more complete than the autozone-bought haynes thing. i have one for my S14 and it is like a thick encyclopedia. for example, just as i typed this, i flipped to the injector section and easily found the injector resistance for the 240SX with the KA24DE to be between 10 - 14 ohms at 25degC.

CandiMan

iTrader: (1)

I believe most Nissan injectors are suppose to be in that range, including ours of course. Aint it fun

bonzelite

iTrader: (2)

i had that same thought. educated guess at the very least, i'd prolly be safe if i read the meter and it showed that range.

i'm going to go ahead and get a service manual anyway as i see it coming in handy as the years go by and the car ages. i was browsing through the S14 service manual and it is just fun and so clear and thorough. reading it and referencing the drawings and diagrams and procedures was inspiring.